what are we going to write about after the war is over?

[HenryMc]

Uh...um....

here are some suggestions?

funny shapes of jello moulds

boner shaped jello moulds

republican auto-eroticism - that's if you can imagine republican's having sex?

democrat auto-eroticism - the converse of above

worst seventies prog rock

a sit com based on Henry Mars and Monte Smith moving into together called 'the Odd Couple' ....where they have wonderful hi jinx ....no wait that's been done ..we'll have to call it 'Harold and Maude' ....oh damn!

a return to old familiar themes ....like retsin....or pie

10 reasons why all posters on this board are the sexiest people on earth

Is self delusion good or bad?

10 best boners in jazz

Just some suggestions I'm sure I'll be entertained anyway

[patricia]

Well, Henry, I hope, for a while, we will write about things other than whether or not we feel that war is the best way to achieve peace. I hope that patriotism will not be measured by how willing we are to bring death and destruction to another country under the guise of liberating them and bringing democracy to them, whether they ask for it or not. I hope that we will see that other cultures will never be like ours, because they ARE other cultures and that change, if and when it comes, must come from within. I hope that we will realize that tyranny is tyranny, whatever it calls itself.

[Chris A]

I'm afraid there will be plenty of disturbing things to write about. This assault/invasion of Iraq is just the beginning, I think. It is already generating veryt angry and determined enemies of the U.S. in other countries, and if Bush and the rest of his un-American regime think that bags of rice and pots of water are going to make the people in this region forget what the U.S. has done to them, he is more naïve than I thought. They are alsready talking about aiming their guns at Jordan. because--get this--they now think that's where Iraq's weapons of mass destruction are. This is like a farce and it would be funny if it wasn't so serious. I can see them attacking Jordan, not finding the WMDs, and then deciding that they have been moved to another country.

It is insanity, and I would not be surprised if Iran gets into this--Jordan will truly be a cakewalk, as these fools like to call it, but Iran is better equipped. Then, of course, there is North Korea.

Is anybody here so out of touch that they think conquering Iraq is going to end Bush the Hun's quest for power? Now they are fighting amongst themselves, trying to determine who will be installed to rule over the spoils in Iraq. Rumsfeld apparently wants a former CIA director there--can you imagine how that will sit with the people in the region? Powell, ir seems, also has his eyes on the job. This is all beyond a summer movie scenario.

[Tanager]

Worst 70s prog-rock gets my vote. Very fertile ground for discussion. I'm trying to boycott any more war threads (how many new ones got started today, holy cow).

[Chris A]

If only it was that simple, Tanager.

[GoodSpeak]

Death.

We will write about death.

The death of free choice, the death of soverignty, the death of American social superiority world wide, the death of self rule, the death of acceptance of Americans, the death of Democracy...here, and IN the United States.

All Hail the American republican Guard!

All hail The Thousand Year Bush/GOP Reich.

[Zieg!] HIEL!

[Zieg!] HIEL!!

[Zeig!] HIEL!!!

[Tanager]

Originally posted by Chris A
If only it was that simple, Tanager.

And why is it not that simple? Do you mean that I'm morally obligated to participate in war threads?

[Chris A]

Originally posted by Tanager
And why is it not that simple? Do you mean that I'm morally obligated to participate in war threads?

Of course not--you can write about rock music, toe nails, Yugoslavian beastiality, homemade wine highs, anything you wish. Many of us--and I bet you'll join in--will undoubtedly find ourselves writing about further Bush atrocities, an economy gone down the drain, etc.

[GoodSpeak]

Originally posted by Tanager
And why is it not that simple? Do you mean that I'm morally obligated to participate in war threads?

Nah.

Only if you actually give a damn.

[Dr Dave]

Post-war thread subjects:

1. Corruption, Political
2. Corruption, Economic
3. Public Figures, Venality of
4. Debt, National
5. Enemies, National, of U.S.
6. Enemies, Individual, of U.S.
7. Paranoia, National
8. Wealth, increase of among the wealthy
9. Wealth, decrease among the poor
10. Bad Behavior, Individual, remedies for:
a. Republican
b. Democratic
c. Libertarian

Not to mention rodents, pie, '70s music, reading habits, alcoholic beverages, religious beliefs, fetishes, etc.

[Tanager]

Originally posted by GoodSpeak
Nah.

Only if you actually give a damn.

Gimme a break and don't be so superior, Goodie. I can certainly give a damn and not participate in another war thread. As Chris notes, I might be drawn in regardless, but my concern (and that of anyone else) can't be measured by my involvement in JC threads.

Now surely someone wants to dissect the Kansas discography?

[Gary Sisco]

what will we talk about?

The next war.

[shrugs]

finding a Democrat that actually has a chance(and a sack)?

[Gary Sisco]

I don't care next time out if they put up a chimp. I'm voting for it.

[patricia]

Originally posted by Gary Sisco
I don't care next time out if they put up a chimp. I'm voting for it.

Isn't that what the Republicans did in 2000??

[Dr Dave]

I am reminded of an old Harvard Lampoon (I believe this was pre-National Lampoon) comedy record in which a Pontiac Grand Prix beats Richard Nixon.

[patricia]

Dr Dave,
I thought I'd seen the most ridiculous win when John Ashcroft was defeated by a dead guy, but............ maybe not.

[HenryMc]

I guess we havent had to bother ........the war in iraq is like Johnnie Walker .....born 2002 ...still going strong

[Gentle Giant]

Not only that, but Al-Qaeda just targeted Cheney, so we have to invade Iraq all over again.

Gulf War III couldn't be worse than Godfather III, could it?

Could it?:(

[patricia]

Not only that, but Al-Qaeda just targeted Cheney, so we have to invade Iraq all over again.

Gulf War III couldn't be worse than Godfather III, could it?

Could it?:(


I thought, up until now, that nothing could be worse than Godfather III. I was wrong.:eek:

[kenny weir]

Not only that, but Al-Qaeda just targeted Cheney, so we have to invade Iraq all over again.

Gulf War III couldn't be worse than Godfather III, could it?

Could it?:(

According to Seymour Hersch, Cheney and Co are back in bed with al-Qaeda's Sunni/Saudi sponsored fellow travellers as a bulwork against the Iran genie they've let out of the bottle. More than ever al-Qaeda seems like an all-purpose bogey man phrase that can mean anything, everything and nothing at all, depending on who's using it. Hard to know through all that BS just what substance the term actually has.

[HenryMc]

Come on down to Al Qaeda's house of missiles. Ex GI armaments at affordable prices for the discerning 'terrist' (sic). The first 10 customers to mention Ossy Binladen get 10% discount!

[Scott Dolan]

According to Seymour Hersch, Cheney and Co are back in bed with al-Qaeda's Sunni/Saudi sponsored fellow travellers as a bulwork against the Iran genie they've let out of the bottle.


Of course they are.

But in a strange twist, they have to "surge" against the Iranian influence that they also helped strengthened.

Try to do the math on THAT one.

[kenny weir]

Try to do the math on THAT one.

It's fucking crazy. My brain hurts. And as I've said elsewhere, it's so preposterous and simply unbelievable that the media has run with "plans to bomb Iran within 24 hours" angle, missing the more interesting and bigger aspects of Hersch's report. Sheeit. If any leftie - or rightie for that matter - came up with the contents of Hersch's NYorker report, they'd be roundly lampooned as a nutjob.

[Scott Dolan]

So the media has dropped the ball?

In what way?

Earlier tonight I was listening to On Point, from WBUR out of Boston (the coolest city in the U.S.!!) where Michael Gordon was being taken to task for being a conduit for the government and not being skeptical enough in his reporting for the NYT.

So what are you seeing over there, Kenny?

[kenny weir]

Scott, I read every word of the Hersch piece earlier in the week. My impression is that more of the substance of his earlier bombshells have been picked up by the mainstream media, here and elsewhere. Here, my usual sources for analysis and news, Melbourne's The Age and the national The Australian, have - AFAIK - not mentioned the Saudi/Sunni/Lebanon/fundamentalist funding aspects at all.

I'm such a disgusted cynic that I do believe, yes, the media has dropped the ball and that it may be because these aspects of story are simply too breathtakingly outrageous to cover.

Even if, as you say, there is a kind of warped logic there.

The Saudis and Prince Bandar are up to their necks in it, which for the Amnerican people in general might justifably smack of loony left scaremongering. I mean, it just couldn't be, could it?

(Apologies for the hijack, Henry!)

[Dr Dave]

In your incredulity over developments in Iraq and Iran, it helps to remember that the true hallmark of the Bush Administration isn't wishful thinking, or secrecy, or expediency. It is sheer, unadulaterated, mind-bending incompetence.

[Gary Sisco]

and stupidity.

When is the war going to be over? They've been getting some killing done somewhere for every minute of my 53 years.

I can't for the life of me understand how Americans have come to view themselves as an unwarlike people.

[Weizen]

I can't for the life of me understand how Americans have come to view themselves as an unwarlike people.

A pox on all those people!!:eek: .....they'll never get near my War-Is-The-Father-Of-All Things Fan Clubhouse here in Nietzscheville, VA.

[Scott Dolan]

I've never heard an American call themself "unwarlike". And aside from Gary's general disdain for human beings, I'm not really sure what he's talking about.

[rollhead]

Dr Dave,
I thought I'd seen the most ridiculous win when John Ashcroft was defeated by a dead guy, but............ maybe not.

That was Mel Carnahan who, when dead, defeated Ashcroft.

Just saw a great "independent lens" documentary on Jeff Smith, who ran for Dick Gephardt's vacant seat in St. Louis. Mel Carnahan's son, Russ Carnahan -- who acts like he is dead (even if he has a pulse) -- defeated Mr. Smith, a incredibly energetic and smart guy who came out of nowhere to almost take out dimwitted Russ.

It was a great film.

http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/mrsmith/film.html#

[Gary Sisco]

That comes as no surprise, Scott.

Ok. I was born in '54. When was the US not getting some killing done, somewhere, since then?

[rollhead]

A pox on all those people!!:eek: .....they'll never get near my War-Is-The-Father-Of-All Things Fan Clubhouse here in Nietzscheville, VA.

Weizen... just curious. How much time did you spend in the military?

[Gary Sisco]

And I don't dislike people at all. I dislike certain people, like anyone else.

I really dislike the laziness of Americans when it comes to political thought. On that score, they have allowed themselves to become both bovine and parrot-like.

It is possible to think for oneself independently of government, party, or media.

Most choose not to. So they get what they get and they deserve their fate.

Ignoring for the moment how a democracy can be said to exist when independent thought is rarer than gold coins.

[rollhead]

Scott, I read every word of the Hersch piece earlier in the week.

Talk about conspiracies. I want to know how a guy in Australia got his copy of The New Yorker "earlier in the week" when I live in New York and just got my subscription copy with the Sy Hersh piece yesterday in the mail.

Did I tell you about the time I played ping-pong with Sy Hersh? This was about 25+ years ago, and he was still riding on the fame of his My Lai stories.

He came to a local college to speak, and I was assigned the job of covering his talk.

Me and another reporter played ping-pong with him (he is a bundle of frenetic energy) before he spoke. I had to laugh. After just about everything he said to us, he would add, "don't quote me on that."

I worry about him. He turns 70 next month. Don't know how much longer he will be able to do what he does -- and no one else in the "media" has his balls.

[Scott Dolan]

It is possible to think for oneself independently of government, party, or media.


Government and party? Yes.

But how do you do it without media?

How do you even know who the President is without getting that information through the media? Let alone what's going on outside of your hometown.

No, the media is useful for context and raw data. Once you've gotten that, well you're lucky if you get the actual context in most cases, THEN you can think "independently" and reach your own conclusions.

[Gary Sisco]

It is possible to think about the information that's public on your own, Scott. Most people don't.

The facts are clear as hell. The president wasn't operating on any information that the rest of us were lacking. The fact is, they were wrong, period. They thought one thing was going to happen and another happened instead because they then and still think if reality doesn't measure up to ideology, then so much the worse for reality.

He wanted a war in Iraq and he got one. He and they thought it would be as "easy" as Poppy's war, forgetting that Poppy's war was in Kuwait and so were the Iraqis, none of whom had any particular reason to want to fight very hard off their own turf, esp against the US with total air superiority.

Invading their towns and neighborhoods, well, of course, was a different question altogether and they are fighting the way anyone would if a foreign army rolled into town lighting the place up. Plus, the former state apparatus having been destroyed, and the people amply armed by looting munitions and ammo dumps -- right in front of American troops, by the way, who did nothing, having no orders to -- the possibility of settling longstanding beefs opened up. So they are. And will.

That's all.

No conspiracy theories are necessary. The admin idiotically got itself into yet another war in the March of Folly. Almost every war is fought for stupid reasons. Why do you think she named the book the way she named it?

[Scott Dolan]

It is possible to think about the information that's public on your own, Scott. Most people don't.



I understand.

But that information is made public by various forms of media. That's why I found your previous statement rather confusing.

But another point you are failing to see here is that everybody can also come to different conclusions when digesting the same information. You mean to say that people who did not reach conclusions similar to your own did not think critically and independently. And that couldn't be further from the truth.

[Weizen]

Weizen... just curious. How much time did you spend in the military?

Rollhead......just curious. For all of your blather about politics/politicians how much time did you spend on a staff or working on campaigns?

[rollhead]

Rollhead......just curious. For all of your blather about politics/politicians how much time did you spend on a staff or working on campaigns?

Weizen. You didn't answer my question. How much time did you spend in the military?

Oh, tough guy with an assault rifle?

(For the record, I was in the Army for four years (regular army NOT reserves) and shot expert with an M-16.)

But I suspect you are a standard, chickenshit warmongering Republican who never served (with honor, or otherwise).

And, for the record, I have covered many politicians as a journalist and worked for several both on the staff and as a volunteer.

My first was in 1972 when I went door-to-door in the poorest neighborhoods of Little Rock, Ark., collecting dollars for George McGovern.

[Gentle Giant]

My first was in 1972 when I went door-to-door in the poorest neighborhoods of Little Rock, Ark., collecting dollars for George McGovern.

Just think, if it wasn't for your efforts, Nixon would've won the election in a landslide. :rolleyes:

[Dr Dave]

Um, let's not start rolling out the bona fides. Besides, who gives a shit? This is the Internet, nobody knows what your deal is anyway. As Frank O'Hara memorably wrote:

You just go on your nerve. If someone’s chasing you down the street with a knife you just run, you don’t turn around and shout, "Give it up! I was a track star for Mineola Prep."

I really couldn't give a shit who did what back when. What have you got NOW?

[rollhead]

Just think, if it wasn't for your efforts, Nixon would've won the election in a landslide. :rolleyes:

Is that why you stay inside before elections?


I really couldn't give a shit who did what back when. What have you got NOW?

Dr. Dave, I was very involved in the most recent local congressional race... were you? oh, yes... i knew there was a reason you don't like to talk about bona fides.


I am trying to establish, for the record, that Weizen is a bona fide chickenshit, who likes to talk about firearms with his pasty and pansy fellow cowards at DoJ, who have helped us reach the pinnacle of global distain with their defense of torture.

[Al in NYC]

Re the Hersh article: I just read it and was delightfully chilled to see that ol' lizard Elliott Abrams scampering out of his neocon hole again. They just keep bringing the lowlife criminals back, don't they?

[Jazzzoline]

Hmm... the next war?

[kenny weir]

Talk about conspiracies. I want to know how a guy in Australia got his copy of The New Yorker "earlier in the week" when I live in New York and just got my subscription copy with the Sy Hersh piece yesterday in the mail.

Posted at organnisimo.

[kenny weir]

Rollhead......just curious. For all of your blather about politics/politicians how much time did you spend on a staff or working on campaigns?

weizen, I've been reading your schtick for long enough to presume you're taking the piss out of yourself here. Like your Washington experience is of any use or relevance, or confers on you any special insights beyond the rest of us. Ha ha.

[Dr Dave]

Dr. Dave, I was very involved in the most recent local congressional race... were you? oh, yes... i knew there was a reason you don't like to talk about bona fides.

Because you worked on a congressional race, that validates your opinion of poor ol' Weizen? Get outta here!

On the other hand, I do understand that because you were very involved in the most recent local congressional race, and I was not, that therefore your dick is much bigger than mine. ;)

[rollhead]

God Bless America

Here they go again,
The Yanks in their armoured parade
Chanting their ballads of joy
As they gallop across the big world
Praising America's God.

The gutters are clogged with the dead
The ones who couldn't join in
The others refusing to sing
The ones who are losing their voice
The ones who've forgotten the tune.

The riders have whips which cut.
Your head rolls onto the sand
Your head is a pool in the dirt
Your head is a stain in the dust
Your eyes have gone out and your nose
Sniffs only the pong of the dead
And all the dead air is alive
With the smell of America's God.

Harold Pinter January 2003

[rollhead]

Because you worked on a congressional race, that validates your opinion of poor ol' Weizen? Get outta here!

On the other hand, I do understand that because you were very involved in the most recent local congressional race, and I was not, that therefore your dick is much bigger than mine. ;)


I changed my mind about Weizen. His friend Trent Lott goes hunting, so he must be a man.

[Weizen]

weizen, I've been reading your schtick for long enough to presume you're taking the piss out of yourself here. Like your Washington experience is of any use or relevance, or confers on you any special insights beyond the rest of us. Ha ha.

Come on Kenny, try not to be a total dumb wad. Just for grins here -- if I happen to know how to draft up a motion to recomit with instructions, or who to call to get an immediate 'please consult us'-- otherwise known as placing a hold on a bill -- or how to put together a 'no funds may be used' amendment that does not have a point of order lie against it ..... of course it's relevant to a discussion and confers upon me 'special insights beyond the rest of' YOU --- in much the same way that were your hero RVG to suddenly appear here and chime in about the issue of microphone placement in a studio, it would absolutely be relevant. Now, when all is said and done, you may very well decide to say something like: 'Mr. RVG, while I'm well aware of your background, I simply have to say that I don't care what the hell you have to say about anything relating to recording'......but you can't say something totally idiotic like: 'your recording experience is of no use or relevance, nor confers on you any special insights beyond the rest of us'. Well, you could....but you'd be a moron. Comprende?

Anyway, I was only tossing back at Rollhead the same sort of dipwad nonsense that his puffed up GI Joe self was flipping in my direction. Given his line of 'reasoning,' anyone who hasn't had an abortion shouldn't be able to talk about it..etc.

And of course, Hillary should certainly shut her trap about all things military (as should all those women members who have never served) right?

[Gary Sisco]

When the music's over
turn out the lights

[Root Doctor]

Anyway, I was only tossing back at Rollhead the same sort of dipwad nonsense that his puffed up GI Joe self was flipping in my direction. Given his line of 'reasoning,' anyone who hasn't had an abortion shouldn't be able to talk about it..etc.

Rollie can speak for himself, but my sense is he's fed up with the ludicrous macho posturings of a bunch of pipsqueaks, who are overly fond of impugning the masculinity (and patriotism) of their opponents. The current crew defiling the Republican Party are, as Alfie Elkins was wont to say, too poncified to throw that kind of slander around.

[Scott Dolan]

Rollie can speak for himself, but my sense is he's fed up with the ludicrous macho posturings of a bunch of pipsqueaks, who are overly fond of impugning the masculinity (and patriotism) of their opponents.


Hahahaha.........thanks, Rootz. I needed a good laugh this morning.

I'm assuming he's so fed up with it because they're stealing his tactics?

[Root Doctor]

Hahahaha.........thanks, Rootz. I needed a good laugh this morning.

I'm assuming he's so fed up with it because they're stealing his tactics?

I thought Rollie was stealing your tactics, Scott.

Don't you think it's pretty inane when someone like Ken Mehlman insults the masculinity of Jack Murtha? I'm no fan of Murtha, who is just an old-fashioned machine pol, but I'm willing to give him his props when it comes to his concern for the military.

[Weizen]

Weizen... just curious. How much time did you spend in the military?


Rollhead......just curious. For all of your blather about politics/politicians how much time did you spend on a staff or working on campaigns?


And, for the record, (he angrily states:mad: ) I have covered many politicians as a journalist and worked for several both on the staff and as a volunteer.

My first was in 1972 when I went door-to-door in the poorest neighborhoods of Little Rock, Ark., collecting dollars for George McGovern.



Dr. Dave, I was very involved in the most recent local congressional race... were you? oh, yes... i knew there was a reason you don't like to talk about bona fides. (so there!! take that, Davey boy!! http://forums.relicnews.com/images/smilies/poke.gif)





Damn Rollhead!http://forums.relicnews.com/images/smilies/lol.gif With all of your 'Oh yes I did!!!' and 'nyah, nyah, nyahs' you're one easy MoFo to lead around! Are you sure you're actually in NY and not hooked up to Gary's barn in VT with a brass ring through your nose?

http://www.gasolinealleyantiques.com/images/Ramp%20Walkers%20Page/rw-brownsteer.JPG

[Weizen]

I'm no fan of Murtha, who is just an old-fashioned machine pol, but I'm willing to give him his props when it comes to his concern for the military.

I actually like the old style machine pols....the Jack Murtha and Rosty types. Even Charlie Rangel is cut from that piece of cloth. With those guys you pretty much knew where you stood and what the drill was. If they looked you in the eye and told you that they might have to swallow hard but that they'd back you on something, then they'd make good on it. If however they told you 'hey, sorry, but I've gotta screw ya on this' -- then they would do that too. Hey, nothing wrong with that imo. It's this newer post 80's breed of pol -- some R's....but mostly duplicitous lib schmuck types in the Rahm Emanuel tradition that you can't trust. Those bastards look you in the eye, tell you they're with you and then knife you.

[Scott Dolan]

I thought Rollie was stealing your tactics, Scott.

Don't you think it's pretty inane when someone like Ken Mehlman insults the masculinity of Jack Murtha? I'm no fan of Murtha, who is just an old-fashioned machine pol, but I'm willing to give him his props when it comes to his concern for the military.


I think Kenny Mehlman is inane in general.

But that still doesn't justify your defense of rollie. If one is "fed up" with certain tactics, why do they also use the same?

This divide and conquer horseshit that folks like Limbaugh and Cheney subscribe to is getting tired and slowly starting to lose steam.

[Root Doctor]

I actually like the old style machine pols....the Jack Murtha and Rosty types. Even Charlie Rangel is cut from that piece of cloth. With those guys you pretty much knew where you stood and what the drill was. If they looked you in the eye and told you that they might have to swallow hard but that they'd back you on something, then they'd make good on it. If however they told you 'hey, sorry, but I've gotta screw ya on this' -- then they would do that too. Hey, nothing wrong with that imo. It's this newer post 80's breed of pol -- some R's....but mostly duplicitous lib schmuck types in the Rahm Emanuel tradition that you can't trust. Those bastards look you in the eye, tell you they're with you and then knife you.

Emanuel is a creep. Just seeing him on TV has me counting my silverware.

Looking in from from the outside, my guess would be that guys like Murtha and Rostenkowski were straightshooters, but I can't support the enormous fiscal waste that comes from their kind of pork barrel politicking.

[Scott Dolan]

Emanuel is the slimiest of them all. He actually makes a cat like Mehlman seem palatable.

But, he is one incredibly smart motherfucker and played a huge role in the Dems takeover.

[Root Doctor]

I think Kenny Mehlman is inane in general.

But that still doesn't justify your defense of rollie. If one is "fed up" with certain tactics, why do they also use the same?

This divide and conquer horseshit that folks like Limbaugh and Cheney subscribe to is getting tired and slowly starting to lose steam.

I wasn't trying to justify it, but it seemed clear to me why he was doing it.

I hope you're right about the divide and conquer horsehit losing steam, although Sean Hannity's recent obsession with people who post on websites about Dick Cheney indicates he may not have caught on yet.

[rollhead]

What do we write about after the war? I think we write about what Harold Pinter is writing about -- bringing the bastards up for war crimes:

House of Commons Speech - Tuesday 21st January 2003

Take note that Pinter said these words in January 2003... and he was right.

Harold Pinter

One of the more nauseating images of the year 2002 is that of our Prime Minister kneeling in the church on Christmas Day praying for peace on earth and good will towards all men while simultaneously preparing to assist in the murder of thousands of totally innocent people in Iraq.

I've been taken to task recently by the American Ambassador to Britain for calling the US Administration a blood thirsty wild animal. All I can say is: take a look at Donald Rumsfeld's face and the case is made.

I believe that not only is this contemplated act criminal, malevolent and barbaric, it also contains within itself a palpable joy in destruction. Power, as has often been remarked, is the great aphrodisiac, and so, it would seem, is the death of others.

The Americans have the ostensible support of the 'international community' through various sure-fire modes of intimidation; bullying, bribery, blackmail and bullshit. The 'international community' becomes a degraded entity bludgeoned into the service of a brutal military force out of control. The most despicable position is that of course of this country which pretends to stand shoulder to shoulder with its great ally while in fact being more of a whipped dog than anyone else. We are demeaned, undermined and dishonoured by our government's contemptible subservience to the United States.

The planned war can only bring about the collapse of what remains of the Iraqi infrastructure, widespread death, mutilation and disease, an estimated one million refugees and escalation of violence throughout the world, but it will still masquerade as a 'moral crusade', a 'just war', a war waged by 'freedom loving democracies', to bring 'democracy' to Iraq.

The stink of the hypocrisy is suffocating.

This is in reality a simple tale of invasion of sovereign territory, military occupation and control of oil.

We have a clear obligation, which is to resist.

[rollhead]

Hahahaha.........thanks, Rootz. I needed a good laugh this morning.

I'm assuming he's so fed up with it because they're stealing his tactics?

I love it when Dolan takes the "high ground," like his fellow rightwing goose-steppers.

Oh, as Pinter would say, the the "stink of your hypocrisy is suffocating."

[rollhead]

Anyway, I was only tossing back at Rollhead the same sort of dipwad nonsense that his puffed up GI Joe self was flipping in my direction. Given his line of 'reasoning,' anyone who hasn't had an abortion shouldn't be able to talk about it..etc.



So, you are admitting that you are a cowardly warmonger who spouts patriotic bullshit but never served?

Oh, the stink of hypocrisy.

Tell us some more about your Colt AR-15 assault rifle. Did your "puffed up John Wayne self" use it to go hunting with Trent Lott and Strom Thurman?

Did you put your white sheets on when you did?

Yuck, yuck, yuck.


(You, by the way, are the one who started this whole assault rifle nonsense, dipwad, when your cowardly jackass self accused me of not knowing what a Colt AR-15 was. I just pointed out you never fired a REAL assault rifle. It was YOUR fucking "line of reasoning." A Colt AR-15 is a M-16 rigged so it can only fire in semi-automatic mode. In short, it is for girly men like you who don't have the balls to sign up to fire a REAL assault rifle.

By the way, do you know what an M-60 is? Ever fired one?)


Damn Rollhead![img]

Weisen is one of these moronic Republicans who thinks he can go around sticking his knife in working class Americans and then just yuck it up and think it is all better.

Keep your idiotic jokes to your fellow Rush Limbaugh fans.

(Ha, ha, did you see that naked Iraqi cower when we had that German shepherd lunge at his crotch!! yuck, yuck, yuck, that's just the kind of thing we did at our fraternity parties! :D :D :D )

Not only do you gutless warmongering Republicans don't have the courage to suit up and go to the wars you started, based on your Republican lies, you don't have the courage to admit that you are stealing from most Americans to do so.

This war has accomplished one thing -- enrich Republican aiders and abetters like Halliburton.

I am so glad you think that Charles Rangel is slimy. Is it because he wants to reinstate the draft, so cowards like you have to go and fight the wars that the people you voted for started?

Tell us some more stories, Weizen, about your segregationist friend and former cheerleader, Trent Lott.

Weizen... i would go running, wee, wee back to friendlier confines, where your waving of rightwing pom-poms is better appreciated. Your "humor" is wasted on me.

http://espn-ak.starwave.com/media/pg2/2002/1216/photo/a_lott_i.jpg

[Scott Dolan]

I wasn't trying to justify it, but it seemed clear to me why he was doing it.

I hope you're right about the divide and conquer horsehit losing steam, although Sean Hannity's recent obsession with people who post on websites about Dick Cheney indicates he may not have caught on yet.


Yeah, you're always going to have the Limbaughs/Hannitys/Savages of this world. But I've just noticed, especially over the past year, how most folks now tend to moderate their political leanings and at least listen to the other sides.

[Weizen]

By the way, do you know what an M-60 is? Ever fired one?)




Weisen is one of these moronic Republicans who thinks he can go around sticking his knife in working class Americans

Oh brother, now he's going to run down the laundry list of weapons and try to play teacher. This from a guy who thinks that Black Talons are what a Marsh Hawk uses to pluck a http://forums.relicnews.com/images/smilies/fish.gif from the water. The dude is Loco. http://forums.relicnews.com/images/smilies/Loco.gif Actually, the funny thing about dopes like you who don't know anything about guns and spout that 'assault style weapon' mantra (Ooooo, they're so scary looking!!) is that anyone with a brain knows that if you want to take out alot of people you use a shotgun, not some 'oooooo it's so scary looking' piece.

btw, I continue to laugh at your efforts to portray yourself as some sort of working class dem cheerleader. My 73 yr-old working class dem Dad who still works in a machine shop in NH 3-4 days a week standing at a machine would laugh himself silly at your refined 'it's a bargain at $180 for 3 ounces' Balsamic Vinegar working class dem tastes. What an effete cornhole. Do you get a monthly pedicure as well?

[rollhead]

btw, I continue to laugh at your efforts to portray yourself as some sort of working class dem cheerleader. My 73 yr-old working class dem Dad who still works in a machine shop in NH 3-4 days a week standing at a machine would laugh himself silly at your refined 'it's a bargain at $180 for 3 ounces' Balsamic Vinegar working class dem tastes. What an effete cornhole. Do you get a monthly pedicure as well?

Yes, I have eaten expensive balsamic vinegar, truffles and foie gras, all while I was either working in restaurant kitchens (that served meals to rich Republicans) or when I took classes at the Culinary Institute of America (so I could get hired to work in nice restaurants.)

As for me being effete, you don't want to take me on, limpdick. You might get your Trent Lott bouffant mussed up. And don't you want to look your best when you are waving your pom-poms for Karl Rove, Grover Norquist, Pat Robertson and your other buddies?

[rollhead]

Yeah, you're always going to have the Limbaughs/Hannitys/Savages of this world. But I've just noticed, especially over the past year, how most folks now tend to moderate their political leanings and at least listen to the other sides.

This is a prizewinner.

Hope someone saves it for the next time Scottie pops a cork.

Did Lois make him promise to take a daily Valium before she let "Banned for Life" Dolan come back?

As long as "decency" is considered a radical concept by people like Dolan and his fellow Republicans like Weizen, don't expect me to "moderate" my views.

Dolan, for the record, is "moderating" his views only because the fucking hole he dug for himself defending all the rightwing nonsense of the current administration was so deep he couldn't get himself out of it.

He put his finger in the air and realize a consensus was building that HE has been so completely WRONG about everything... that he is posing as a "moderate."

It's moderation as a cowardly act.

[Weizen]

I will get back to you on this... I am still laughing my head off for hours at your limpdickedness. I can barely type now.

See, I knew you'd never worked in politics. I mean, what kind of staffer worth a shit can't laugh out loud while simultaneously working the keyboard and cancelling out a proposed bridge or road project for Upstate NY in a draft version of the Highway Bill? Well, after you regain your composure and finish putting a shine to your little 'Ranger Rick Club' Marksman medals, you feel free to "get back to [me] on this." Perhaps after you've walked me through all of the various sidearms you can school me in armor next (....maybe WWII?) ....and tell me all about how you recently serviced the 700hp Maybach engine on that Panther you've got stored in your garage....and maybe share some stories about how you were in the foxhole with Thurmond when you guys parachuted into Normandy? :rolleyes:

[Weizen]

As for me being effete, you don't want to take me on, limpdick. You might get your Trent Lott bouffant mussed up.


...oh, by the way.....as you obviously noticed last month, I actually posted a couple of pics of myself on a thread here. So where are yours, gorgeous? :D Step up to the plate.

[Weizen]

Dolan, for the record, is "moderating" his views only because the fucking hole he dug for himself defending all the rightwing nonsense of the current administration was so deep he couldn't get himself out of it.

He put his finger in the air and realize a consensus was building that HE has been so completely WRONG about everything... that he is posing as a "moderate."

It's moderation as a cowardly act.

Oh, here's another one. Someone else is a coward, eh? Damn, don't tell me we've got another ideologue board warrior who likes to hurl the bricks but doesn't have the nads to post a pic of himself? Hey, I'm not a big fan of liberals but I do have some respect for the ones who will at least allow me to see who it is that's telling me to eat flaming death :D and aren't hiding behind their keyboard with a Zoro mask on. So, to recap -- I'm the limpdick pansy....and so is Dolan (who also has posted pics of himself online) -- but you're the pillar of stone hiding behind the curtain up there in Oz, right?

[Scott Dolan]

I think a peek at his bank account balance would be interesting also. It must certainly be empty since he gives all his money back to the poor.

[groover]

I think a peek at his bank account balance would be interesting also. It must certainly be empty since he gives all his money back to the poor.

A peek at anyone's portfolio today will be depressing, the way the market's going.

[Scott Dolan]

Rollie would never own stock, Groovz.

That would ruin his reputation.

[steve(thelil)]

See, I knew you'd never worked in politics. I mean, what kind of staffer worth a shit can't laugh out loud while simultaneously working the keyboard and cancelling out a proposed bridge or road project for Upstate NY in a draft version of the Highway Bill? Well, after you regain your composure and finish putting a shine to your little 'Ranger Rick Club' Marksman medals, you feel free to "get back to [me] on this." Perhaps after you've walked me through all of the various sidearms you can school me in armor next (....maybe WWII?) ....and tell me all about how you recently serviced the 700hp Maybach engine on that Panther you've got stored in your garage....and maybe share some stories about how you were in the foxhole with Thurmond when you guys parachuted into Normandy? :rolleyes:

I happen to know for a fact that he worked in politics. On a high level. For at least two very powerful politicians.

You dislike Rollhead for his tendency to make personal attacks on other posters. Yet you respond with the same type of shit. So two knowledgeable guys end up in yet another boring ho-hum pissing contest that at best, preaches to the respective choirs. Yawn.

Weizen: You might have valuable experience and thoughtful stuff to say. But you lose credibility when you become sucked into Rollie's sideshow.

I've worked in politics too. And I've gotten to know some political heavyweights. I have also learned that being a political heavyweight does not, in itself, make someone worthy of respect. Often quite the contrary.

Instead of blowing your own horn or telling us why we should believe you, try making your points speak for themselves. I, for one, will be more willing to listen seriously to you.

[Al in NYC]

Would be nice if Weizen on occasion clearly stated his position and tried to defend it. At least Rollhead does that. Instead all I see from him are occasioanlly witty, but snarky, remarks, followed up by personal attacks.

[steve(thelil)]

Would be nice if Weizen on occasion clearly stated his position and tried to defend it. At least Rollhead does that. Instead all I see from him are occasioanlly witty, but snarky, remarks, followed up by personal attacks.

Weizen mentioned early in his tenure here that he likes to piss off liberals. Since then, rightly or wrongly, I often see this as his motivation when he posts something. It's not easy for me to credit arguments from people whose motivation is to piss off people who disagree with them.

To me, a big problem in both government and politics is people who are much more concerned with their perceived political enemies than the principles that they stand for. (I'm not saying this trait is limited to conservatives.) If Weizen is more interested in pissing off people he disagrees with than convincing them of what he believes, it's hard to look at what he writes as insights, as opposed to, say, personality quirks.

I would probably think Rollie is an intelligent yet incendiary dork if I didn't know him outside of Jazz Corner. I knew him first in person (where his personality is NOTHING like his posting personality), and for this reason, I often think I know when he is trying to entertain people with similar beliefs, and I'm more amused than I would otherwise be (eg. when he appears to be flaming).

For this reason, I tend to cut him alot more slack than I cut Weizen (and more slack than anyone would expect Weizen to cut Rollie). It's entirely possible that in person Weizen and Rollie could have a meaningful conversation where they would actually try to understand the differences in their positions. I know Rollie could (believe it or not).

[Scott Dolan]

What would really be nice if for rollie to get over this sniper mode episode. I always end up putting him on ignore until his meds kick in, and I even like the guy!

[rollhead]

You dislike Rollhead for his tendency to make personal attacks on other posters. Yet you respond with the same type of shit. So two knowledgeable guys end up in yet another boring ho-hum pissing contest that at best, preaches to the respective choirs. Yawn.



Steve. I appreciate your words.

But, you are right, I shouldn't bore you or anyone else with pissing contests.

What would really be nice if for rollie to get over this sniper mode episode. I always end up putting him on ignore until his meds kick in, and I even like the guy!

Bastard, you know the only time you make me cry is when you say such sweet things about me.

[kenny weir]

Come on Kenny, try not to be a total dumb wad.

Oh yeah sure the machinations of Washington are a lot for anyone to get their head around. And I'm sure there's a big, big difference in effectiveness between the good and lousy operators in that regard, and for all I know you may be one of the good and/or great ones.

But to use that experience as preseumed proof of a better informed and wiser mind about such things as foriegn policy, Iraq, the WoT, etc, whatever is BS. It smacks of a "leave up to us, the experts" mentality. And look where that's got us.

The likes of "how to draft up a motion to recomit with instructions, or who to call to get an immediate 'please consult us'-- otherwise known as placing a hold on a bill -- or how to put together a 'no funds may be used' amendment that does not have a point of order lie against it" strikes me as preposterously narrow, arcane and largely useless experience for leadership or even commentary. :p

That Washington is presumably stuffed with folks who think it is, is frankly scary as hell.

[kenny weir]

I've worked in politics too. And I've gotten to know some political heavyweights. I have also learned that being a political heavyweight does not, in itself, make someone worthy of respect. Often quite the contrary.

Yup.

[Weizen]

The likes of "how to draft up a motion to recomit with instructions, or who to call to get an immediate 'please consult us'-- otherwise known as placing a hold on a bill -- or how to put together a 'no funds may be used' amendment that does not have a point of order lie against it" strikes me as preposterously narrow, arcane and largely useless experience for leadership or even commentary. :p

That Washington is presumably stuffed with folks who think it is, is frankly scary as hell.


Hmmm. I guess you read the chapters on how if you don't understand something the best refuge is playing the mocking cynic, hoping no one sees through it to the clueless shill behind it. Yup... knowledge of how to actually enact ideas sure seems a waste of brain power. :rolleyes: What we really need are more people with policy ideas they have no idea of how to accomplish -- because by golly that will certainly give us all a lot of confidence that their ideas might even work.

Leadership. It's knowing not a lick about how to get things done. Nice ring to it really.

But you know, the funny thing about folks like you Kenny......you want to control, restrict and limit who can say what about things that YOU consider yourself an expert in.....as in after all what could others POSSIBLY know about topic A or B unless they have been there and done it? But then when folks have the temerity to point out how foolish that little dictate is for debates in the public sphere -- well then, you are trapped in a web of your own making. Because, if expertise does matter, then why should anyone care what you think about 99% of the public policy debates and maneuvering that occurs. And why should any women candidate ever be taken seriously for President or Speaker when we are at war -- as very, very few have any expertise in this area? Which is the point I made in my previous post.

But if expertise doesn't matter -- as you seem to now want to claim when it suits you -- then there goes your little self-annointed role of making sure people only participate in threads where they meet some test of yours for adequate knowledge to participate.

Any way one looks at it, you really do come off as a frightful bore about the whole thing, Ken.

[kenny weir]

But you know, the funny thing about folks like you Kenny......you want to control, restrict and limit who can say what about things that YOU consider yourself an expert in.....as in after all what could others POSSIBLY know about topic A or B unless they have been there and done it? But then when folks have the temerity to point out how foolish that little dictate is for debates in the public sphere -- well then, you are trapped in a web of your own making......
But if expertise doesn't matter - as you seem to now want to claim when it suits you - then there goes your little self-annointed role of making sure people only participate in threads where they meet some test of yours for adequate knowledge to participate.

Any way one looks at it, you really do come off as a frightful bore about the whole thing, Ken.

Nah, don't want to control any debate or thread, including this one, you or anyone else. Can you show me a single instance where I have done so? Just calling you on your BS.

I didn't say expertise doesn't matter. What I am saying is that your oft-cited expertise has, really, very narrow and not very meaningful applications. Policy is fine and vital, but when you talk up your Washington credientials, it invariably seems more about mechanics than anything else. As I said, very important in their way, but ...

And I have no test for "adequate knowledge to participate", and certainly claim none for myself except intense and lively interest.

Me a frightful bore? That's rich! :p

[Weizen]

You dislike Rollhead for his tendency to make personal attacks on other posters. Yet you respond with the same type of shit.

For this reason, I tend to cut him alot more slack than I cut Weizen .

No, it's a bit more than that. I dislike him for taking things to the next (lower) level, starting in with the KKK/nazi stuff. I'm sure that you saw the cartoon today....and it's not the first time with this guy. And 'no', my zinging him on such things as Colt AR-15s, Gummi Bears and Balsamic Vinegar isn't even in the same category as hurling around the ugly KKK, white hood material he seems fond of. Sooooo, if in fact, as previously stated, you actually know the man, perhaps you would be so kind as to drop him a note and have a conversation about this?

All things considered, Steven, I'm surprised that you'd want to cut someone who accuses others of being Klansmen (or sympathizers in favor of lynchings), any slack at all?

[Weizen]

I didn't say expertise doesn't matter. What I am saying is that your oft-cited expertise has, really, very narrow and not very meaningful applications. :p


No kidding, Dorothy! Why do you think people pay large sums of money to lobbyists? "experti$e ha$ very narrow, very meaningful application$" is more like it. Anyway....we're done wasting breath on the Australian who never let anyone over at Organissimo forget that he's a reporter chock full of insight from afaaaaaar, damit!

[kenny weir]

No kidding, Dorothy! Why do you think people pay large sums of money to lobbyists? "experti$e ha$ very narrow, very meaningful application$" is more like it. Anyway....we're done wasting breath on the Australian who never let anyone over at Organissimo forget that he's a reporter chock full of insight from afaaaaaar, damit!

Ha ha. Same as in Australia, I'd guess US lobbyists get paid heaps 'coz they help clients make (more) money - not because they have any concern about the future of the planet/whatever.

I've never been a reporter.

And whatever my level of insight, my point is that your level of same is no greater than mine or anyone else around here, contrary to what you frequently assert on the basis of your Washington chops.

[Weizen]

[QUOTE=kenny weir;599737]Ha ha. Same as in Australia, I'd guess US lobbyists get paid heaps 'coz they help clients make (more) money - not because they have any concern about the future of the planet/whatever.

Wow, there's a real winner of a statement. Ken, time to put on your thinking cap and concentrate hard on cleaning the lint from your belly button!

[kenny weir]

Wow, there's a real winner of a statement. Ken, time to put on your thinking cap and concentrate hard on cleaning the lint from your belly button!

Ahhh, the familiar Weizen sneer!

[Weizen]

I'd guess US lobbyists get paid heaps 'coz they help clients make (more) money - not because they have any concern about the future of the planet/whatever.

Wow, there's a real winner of a statement.

Ahhh, the familiar Weizen sneer!

Sneer? Oh, is that what you call it when you look down your nose and mock everybody who decides to make a living as a lobbyist/advocate? Not caring about humanity??? What is that all about, Ken???? :confused:

...actually, no need to further elaborate.....I don't want to have to wade through an ocean's worth of vague sanctimonious platitudes. I'd rather just go read a page or two out of an Al Gore book.:rolleyes:

[Dr Dave]

What are we going to write about when the war is over?

Ourselves, apparently.

[kenny weir]

Sneer? Oh, is that what you call it when you look down your nose and mock everybody who decides to make a living as a lobbyist/advocate?

Lobbyists/advocates do what they do, no mystery. Passing judgment on them as a class would be like slamming a rock for being a ... rock.

The down the nose bit applies only to you and the frequency with which you use your method of making a living as proof of wisdom on a wide variety of issues denied many of those you interact with online.

[Weizen]

Lobbyists/advocates do what they do, no mystery. Passing judgment on them as a class would be like slamming a rock for being a ... rock.

The down the nose bit applies only to you and the frequency with which you use your method of making a living as proof of wisdom on a wide variety of issues denied many of those you interact with online.

Presently, I'm neither a lobbyist nor a congressional employee....so once again you're jumping to conclusions. Sloppy, sloppy, Ken....you'd never make it through the first year of Law School.

[kenny weir]

Presently, I'm neither a lobbyist nor a congressional employee....so once again you're jumping to conclusions. Sloppy, sloppy, Ken....you'd never make it through the first year of Law School.

Yeah well sorry 'bout that. It's just that you DO bring your experience in that field up quite often you know. :o As for sloppy ... as I said earlier, I've never been a reporter, as you wrote. Never make it through the first year of law school? I'm cool with that.

[Weizen]

Yeah well sorry 'bout that. It's just that you DO bring your experience in that field up quite often you know. :o

Yeah, well so what? That's what people do, Einstein! Bing! http://www.jazzcornertalk.com/speakeasy/images/icons/icon3.gif

Lot's of people on lot's of boards frequently jump into conversations to let you know that when they were a producer for Riverside, they 'would often.....'

..... OR, when they were a recording engineer they 'would often.....'....

.... OR, when they were involved in remastering a boatload of Fantasy titles for 45-rpm vinyl release they 'would often....'......

......OR, when they owned a music store they 'would often...'

........etc.

That's not even counting the consumate club goers who frequently jump in to let folks know about the time they yucked it up with Philly Joe at Birdland in '59....or Jack Sheldon at Shelly's Manne Hole in '69....or Thad & Elvin at some other joint in '85, etc, etc. Then you've got the folks who always pop in to let you know that 'yes' they do indeed have the original deep groove copy of half the recorded LPs known to man, etc... and of course, I have no problem with any of the above ...cause it's what people do.

Hey, if you and your wife had a combined 35 years of Capitol Hill experience, it would be next to impossible not to mention it from time to time on political threads, doncha think? Naa, I'm sure you wouldn't. :rolleyes: Yep, my guess is that if you were an ex-Clinton White House aide, you'd just hang out on political threads and pretend you worked in a Sardine cannery, right? Gimme a break. :rolleyes: Look, if someone lifts a bum list of congressional votes from some questionable online source and proceeds to use it to bash in the skull of a pol, you can bet that I'm going to weigh in and set the record straight re: which votes are bogus and which are real. Sorry if that sticks in your craw........you'll get over it. :p

[kenny weir]

Yeah, well so what? Hey, if you and your wife ... Sorry if that sticks in your craw........you'll get over it. :p

Craw? Nah, it's cool. Oi, are you confusing me with a name-dropper? - Kenny "Never Been Married" Weir

[Scott Dolan]

End of the discussion.

[Ron Thorne]

What "discussion"?

I hope whatever it was is over, however.

[edpack]

You don't have to worry about it .....this war won't be over for a long time...

[Root Doctor]

Hey, if you and your wife had a combined 35 years of Capitol Hill experience

This has to be the most ludicrous business convention of the past twenty years. "We've only been in business for two years, but the ten of us have twenty years of combined experience." No, you all have two years experience.

[Gary Sisco]

There are some as well who consider Congress itself in as negative a light as any presidency. I'm one of them. A gathering of whores, poseurs, and worse. If these are the best 300 million people can cough up, well, that speaks for itself.

[Coda]

Three year old Timmy Frampton admitted that toddlers were not winning the War on Pigeons and a new strategy was required if the conflict was to be resolved.

http://newsbiscuit.com/images/424.jpg

For too long our tactics have been to run at the pigeons with our arms outstretched, screaming. This has proved a miscalculation.’ he said, addressing cross-legged representatives of local playgroups. ‘The pigeons have a superior air force, to be sure, but we have far greater strength during a ground offensive. The pigeons often run for a few feet before taking off just before we can get hold of them. If we can stop them from flying away we will have them.’

Frampton emphasized the need for more children to patrol the streets in search of anything they suspect to be a pigeon and run at it at a slightly slower pace, trying really hard not to laugh. He also assured the other pre-schoolers that ‘Operation stamping on the ground to make a flock of pigeons fly up at the same time’ was proving successful and would continue on the walk home from school, prompting applause and some juice-spillage.

Despite the generally positive reaction to the proposed new strategy, dissent was heard from some quarters. One child was heard questioning what they would do if they ever actually caught a pigeon. While another was heckled for suggested the War on Pigeons was taking time and resources from other more-pressing concerns such as sand eating and mixing up the plasticine colors. With the discontent threatening to get out of hand and Frampton was forced to close the conference early, saying everyone was getting ‘over-tired’.

[Weizen]

This has to be the most ludicrous business convention of the past twenty years. "We've only been in business for two years, but the ten of us have twenty years of combined experience." No, you all have two years experience.

Yes, but that assumes that you all went into business at the same time....and that no one in the crowd had logged additional years prior to hooking up with the others, oui? So, if person 'A' worked in the E. Digby Baltzell Brewery from 1979-2005 and person 'B' worked in both the E. Digby Baltzell Brewery and the neighboring Pernicious Prioress Punished Agnes By Chaining Her In The Dungeon Brewery from 1986-1996, let's see if you can play Hungarian math whiz and perform a quick calculation and tell us exactly how to fill in the following sentence:

Together, me and my twin _____________________ in the brewing industry.

http://www.lib.unc.edu/ncc/gallery/images_more/twins_large.gif

[bluenoter]

Three year old Timmy Frampton admitted that toddlers were not winning the War on Pigeons and a new strategy was required if the conflict was to be resolved . . .

http://newsbiscuit.com/images/424.jpg

For too long our tactics have been to run at the pigeons with our arms outstretched, screaming . . .

Frampton emphasized the need . . .

Despite the generally positive reaction to the proposed new strategy, dissent was heard from some quarters . . .
Source: NewsBiscuit (http://newsbiscuit.com/article/toddlers-admit-failed-strategy-in-war-on-pigeons-017)
Posted: 24 February 2007 by Phil Smith (who presumably isn't Coda)

Or perhaps it's from elsewhere online. Plagiarizing now, are you, Coda? :rolleyes:


http://farm1.static.flickr.com/154/356375098_99c7a791ca_m.jpg (http://www.thehungersite.com)

[Scott Dolan]

I'm fairly certain nobody was assuming Coda wrote that piece.

[Root Doctor]

Yes, but that assumes that you all went into business at the same time....and that no one in the crowd had logged additional years prior to hooking up with the others, oui? So, if person 'A' worked in the E. Digby Baltzell Brewery from 1979-2005 and person 'B' worked in both the E. Digby Baltzell Brewery and the neighboring Pernicious Prioress Punished Agnes By Chaining Her In The Dungeon Brewery from 1986-1996, let's see if you can play Hungarian math whiz and perform a quick calculation and tell us exactly how to fill in the following sentence:

Together, me and my twin _____________________ in the brewing industry.

http://www.lib.unc.edu/ncc/gallery/images_more/twins_large.gif

The answer would be 26 years (79-05), not 36 on the bozo meter.

[Gary Sisco]

I wonder what would happen if one got decided to get really fat and the other not.

[rollhead]

Four years too many ....

http://www.mediachannel.org/wordpress/2007/03/19/take-action-demand-better-iraq-war-coverage-2/

I am joining MediaChannel.org and hundreds of thousands of Americans in calling on your media outlet to do a better job of reporting on the war in Iraq and the unprecedented level of protests against it.

As the fifth year of the occupation of Iraq begins, as the conflict in Afghanistan escalates and as threat of war with Iran builds, can you honestly say that your news organization is doing a better job than it did in the days when it shamelessly served as a cheerleader for the occupation of Iraq?

It is very upsetting to see the same media/propaganda techniques that led to the catastrophe in Iraq being deployed again to encourage violence against Tehran?

While there has been some improvements in coverage as Congressional opposition mounts, the anti-war movement, the voices from the region and critical perspectives are still being marginalized. US Government sources are still being given more credence than the ideas of those who opposed the war.

We need real journalism, not jingoism.

We propose more coverage and better coverage including:

1. Inside-Out Reporting

Media companies are locked into "outside-in" stand-ups when what's needed is "inside-out" coverage. Let’s hear more from the Iraqi people and from more diverse sources.

2. Reports That Question Official Claims

We need more aggressive reporting, not just official stenography.

3. Independent Assessments of Political Developments

Let’s hear from international experts, not just pro-war pundits.

4. Unembedded Photography

We need to see real images from the war zone.

5. Footage, Footage, Footage

Networks have footage they are not showing. This cover-up must be ended.

6. Follow-up on Corruption Investigations

There have been reports on billion-dollar financial scandals but little follow-up. How is our tax money being squandered? Tell us.

7. Follow-up on Wounded Soldiers and Iraqis

Our Veteran hospitals are flooded with war casualties. Iraqi facilities and humanitarian support facilities are terribly under funded as resources are diverted away from reconstruction and services into “security” for U.S. forces.

These are just a few suggestions. Media professionals know what’s missing and many are ashamed by the performance of news organizations that have been bullied into backing the war and following right-wing agendas.

Objectivity in Iraq and Iran coverage in most US media outlets is a joke, the laughingstock of the media world.

What are you prepared to do to restore your credibility and trust among your readers, listeners, and viewers? How will you show your integrity?

Let us know.

We say: SHOW AND TELL THE TRUTH ABOUT THE WAR!

End the spin and pro-war tilt.

All Americans expect integrity in Media.

Signed,

[gonzo]

the new war in iran and syria!!!!:eek:

[Jeffrey Wozniak]

End the spin and pro-war tilt.

Can you provide just a few examples of this "pro-war tilt" coming from ABC, NBC, CBS, MSNBC, CNN, The NYT, Washington Post, Time, Newsweek, etc in the last few years?

Just a few examples please. Take your time. We'll be waiting patiently...

[Dr Dave]

"Recent years." That's coy. The year that counts is 2003, when the media actually believed all the shit the White House was feeding them.

[Gary Sisco]

Or professed to believe, is more accurate. They all had all of the information necessary to refute the Bushists' lies. They published and broadcasted the information, in fact. The Times has twice apologized. You'd think once would have been embarrassing enough.

[Jeffrey Wozniak]

Still patiently waiting for a few examples to back up the claim of "pro-war" tilt.