Favorite non-Jazz record labels

[achilles]

there are so many good indie labels out there these days and many of them have gotten incredibly diverse so they have a roster that touches on pop, IDM, avant rock, ambient, alt. country, etc etc

my favorites these days seems to be:

Kranky
Constellation
Thrill Jockey
Rune Grammafon
Drag City

how about you? and why? and who? etc etc

[Monte Smith]

Document
Yazoo

[Jon Abbey]

just took a look at the Kranky catalog, and I have an absurd percentage of the first 40 releases, but I can't say I have any interest in them these days. have you heard the first Magnog release, Achilles? maybe the best thing in the catalog, I always thought godspeed were more of a live band.

also, looking at your label list, I'm curious as to whether you're a fan of the Dirty Three, a band whose work holds up better for me than most of the output of those labels, albeit along roughly similar lines.

Blood and Fire and Strut are both doing superb, consistently reliable work, albeit in reissues.

[achilles]

jon,
yeah, right on, I'm a Dirty Three fan.
Have not heard the Magnog--should I? Why? etc

some great bands on Constellation out of Montreal too.

[Chris Castelle]

Pirhana is a fantastic "world music" label from Germany with great packaging, a great attitude (check out piranha.de (http://www.piranha.de) ) and a diverse catalog that runs from Jewish and Eastern European music (what I know them for) to African and Latin. Frank London's Brotherhood of Brass releases on Piranha and the Boban Markovic Orchestra Live in Belgrade are highly enjoyable, and, in the case of the Markovic, really important releases. You don't find many recordings of Serbian gypsy brass bands in their native environment.

[Jon Abbey]

why should you hear the Magnog? dunno, it has a little more heart and soul than most of the ambient guitarscapes that Kranky's put out, at least that era Kranky, along the lines of Ash Ra Tempel, maybe.

all the Constellation stuff I've heard sounds pretty self-indulgent to me, not my thing.

[Sergio Zamora]

Def Jux
Blood and Fire

[Pete C]

Besides Piranha, other favorite "world music" labels include

Chhanda Dhara (Indian music)
Network
Hannibal
Nonesuch/World Circuit (Nick Gold productions)
Luaka Bop (I don't like David Byrne, but his company puts out great albums)
Indigo (African music from the same people as Label Bleu)
Putumayo
Buda Musique
Lumiar (Brazilian publisher of songbooks of Brazilian songwriters and accompanying compilation albums)

[Jon Abbey]

did you pick up the recent double disc of RJD2 on Def Jux, OZ? I liked Deadringer a lot, but I wasn't sure if I needed a double disc of odds and ends, would love to hear feedback. I have a feeling Def Jux is pretty near the end of their run, I hope I'm wrong...

[Sergio Zamora]

I actually have 'Deadringer' in my FE order basket cookie right now, but I might pass 'The Horror' for now.

[achilles]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey

all the Constellation stuff I've heard sounds pretty self-indulgent to me, not my thing.

jeeze, Jon, did the founder of erstwhile and most tireless promoter of "eai" actually accuse another label/kind of music of being self-indulgent? I'm sorry but that made me laugh pretty heartily. We clearly have different definitions of self-indulgent.....

[Tanager]

The only non-Jazz non-major label I ever really cared about in and of itself was SST, a damned fine label in its day.

[Jon Abbey]

jeeze, Jon, did the founder of erstwhile and most tireless promoter of "eai" actually accuse another label/kind of music of being self-indulgent? I'm sorry but that made me laugh pretty heartily. We clearly have different definitions of self-indulgent..... [/QUOTE]

oh man, here we go. yes, constellation is a label set up specifically to document every random gurgle and burp by anyone who's ever shared a communal bowl with any member of godspeed you black emperor!, excuse me if I'm misplacing the exclamation point. there's absolutely no quality control, as it's a label run by a collective of musicians, and not an especially talented bunch. it pretty much defines self-indulgence in my book. please point me to the timeless masterpieces I've overlooked thus far.

I didn't voice my opinion on this until you mentioned them twice. am I not allowed to have an opinion? I've seen godspeed live three times, including from five feet away at their first US show at the Cooler. they actually tapped into something in the zeitgeist in late-'99, pre-millennial dread, and they got another burst after 9/11, but they're totally one-note and it's a pretty fucking boring one by now, TO MY EARS.

as for erstwhile and "eai", I am indeed the most tireless promoter of what I consider to be good music in said field (which has yet to result in selling 1000 copies of any title, for the record). I am also the toughest critic of anything in said field I consider to be below a certain level of excellence, and most of all any erstwhile releases in the works. just because this isn't always a totally public process doesn't mean it's not happening, and I think the label's releases speak for themselves.

how many of the 30 erstwhile releases have you actually heard, and which would you describe as self-indulgent? thanks for your insights in advance.

OZ, Deadringer's very good, a bit like DJ Shadow, but I like that disc more than any Shadow I've heard.

[achilles]

hey, and I'm as entitled to my opinion too, Jon
How come it's okay for you to express yours with
such uncalled for arrogance, but whenever someone
speaks back to that, you get upset and self-righteous?

I've now listened to my 6th erstwhile release, Wrapped Islands, as you recommended--and I found it having too little Fennesz for my taste. I don't need to "hear" anymore erst.

Seems to me a "music" devoted to recording micro-sound, table-top guitar scratches, stretches of silence, and sine waves, might justifiably be called self-indulgent by some. to quote you, Jon, "it's pretty fucking boring to my ears."

i'm glad you think YOU can decide the timeless masterpieces (and no doubt, they all involve Keith Rowe).

You're allowed to voice your opinion, jon, but why use this harmless thread i started as an opportunity to dismiss the music i like? what are you hoping to accomplish by that? it didn't ask you to do so, there was no challenge mentioned in the beginning of the thread, i just don't get you.

[Jon Abbey]

"Seems to me a "music" devoted to recording micro-sound, table-top guitar scratches, stretches of silence, and sine waves, might justifiably be called self-indulgent by some."

interesting. if you have a chance, please forward me a list of which sounds from which instruments are capable of being used in a non-indulgent manner. off the top of my head, I don't think there's a single Erst release containing even two seconds of silence within the music, even dach has consistent room tone. since you seem to have the attention span of a gnat, you wouldn't know that. again, please enlighten me: which of the 6 erstwhile releases you've heard would you describe as self-indulgent?

"You're allowed to voice your opinion, jon, but why use this harmless thread i started as an opportunity to dismiss the music i like? what are you hoping to accomplish by that? it didn't ask you to do so, there was no challenge mentioned in the beginning of the thread, i just don't get you."

I didn't say anything about Constellation until you mentioned it a second time, seemingly directly to me. I then wrote "all the Constellation stuff I've heard sounds pretty self-indulgent to me, not my thing." it's not as if I'm the only one that holds this opinion, I think it's pretty widely held among people who have heard a fair amount of the catalog. if you're into it, that's cool. I was just answering for myself. I'm still waiting to hear from you what the best release in their catalog is.

and I'm not hoping to accomplish anything, my background is as a music fan, I've heard a lot of music, and occasionally I like to join in on the discussion, even if it's not entirely positive. sorry if you take that personally.

"I don't need to "hear" anymore erst."

I commend you on your usage of quotation marks here, very self-aware.

[achilles]

jon,
if your arrogance and name-calling makes you feel better,
than I hope you're feeling real good right now.

you don't express opinions, you slash and burn and then offer
up your usual sanctimonious spiel with an added dash of syncophancy for all your beloved erst artists.

at this point, i take back everything nice i ever said about you, and will not miss you if you run off crying again.

[Pete C]

Can somebody recommend the three or four top room tone players?

[Jon Abbey]

" i take back everything nice i ever said about you"

that's fine, you never really meant it anyway. you're extremely hostile just below the surface, on this site and in private e-mail.

you and I have really different tastes in music, it seems pretty obvious by now. I've managed to learn to live with it. sorry if my opinions are expressed too strongly for you, I'm not sure what the point of equivocating even more than I do already would be.

I'm still interested in hearing about:

1) the best record released by your beloved Constellation.

2) which of the six Erst releases you've heard you consider to be self-indulgent (also, please list the others, so I know which ones are OK by you).

[Jon Abbey]

ah, mr. cherches has chimed in, with yet another insightful snippet of snideness. thanks for sharing!

[Pete C]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey
would love to hear feedback.

I resisted commenting on that...

[achilles]

oh, well, another thread spoiled.

Just wanted to hear what labels people love,
but jon had to use it as an opportunity to alienate.

had you put erstwhile as your favorite label,
i wouldn't have shot back with some dismissive and offensive
remark--because it would have been uncalled for and
not at all germane to the thread. your "forceful opinions"
are just more of your inane craving for attention.
this was not a thread that said, 'Jon, please insult labels
other people respect.'

basically, you're not interested in anything but your own
self-indulgent rhetoric, so i'm not going to engage you any
further.

[Vince Kargatis]

Originally posted by achilles
oh, well, another thread spoiled.

Which I would lay on you, achilles: Jon criticized a label (a non-personal attack), and then you criticized his opinion (well...implicitly called him a hypocrite - a personal attack). What followed was entirely predictable, particularly with Jon's known strongly reactive proclivities against such.

Some more notable on-topic labels:
Matador (kudos especially to their mp3 page)
Merge
Mud
(why I just listed three Ms I dunno)
DeSoto (only because they released records from two faves: Dismemberment Plan and Burning Airlines)
Ninja Tune's a fun one

Some world music standbys:
Ocora
World Music Library (King Records)

[john williams]

Hey Achilles,

I love Constellation and think GYBE are one of the most interesting bands around at the moment. Yeah, they may play "minimally" but its not how many notes you play its how you play them.

I also like Labradford (Mi media naraja) and Low (Things We Lost In The Fire) - both on Kranky.

I also like Nonesuch for their commitment to new "classical".
John Adams
Kronos
Steve Reich
Some Philip glass

[Ron Thorne]

For a change of pace:

Deutsch Gramaphone
Angel
RCA Red Label
Smithsonian/Folkways Records

[john williams]

Originally posted by Ron Thorne
Smithsonian/Folkways Records

Yes, I have the Harry Smith's "Anthology of American Folk Music " which I absolutely adore. Its not something I want to hear everday but it still surprises me from time to time. Oh and the packaging and books essays etc. are probably the best I have seen.


http://www.good-music-guide.com/images/cd011large.jpg


http://www.folkways.si.edu/harry/images/hapoint.gif

[Tanager]

I have no idea if they're still in business, but Durham's own Sugar Hill Records...

[walto]

Chandos, Erato, DG, Vox, Harmonia Mundi, Wergo, Donemus

[john williams]

Wergo is am interesting one. I only know the Ligeti Kammerkonzert/Ramifications/Lux Aeterna/Atmospheres release. However, I decided to give it a spin after Walter mentioned the label. Thanks, Gyorgy had been gathering some undserved dust recently.

[Root Doctor]

Arhoolie remains tough to beat, with dozens of essential records in its catalog. Rounder is far less interesting than it once was, but good releases still appear on the roster from time to time. I still buy a fair amount of stuff on Norton, Yep Roc, Hightone, Estrus, Swallow, Maison de Soul, Revenant, and Fat Possum. For reggae, it's Blood and Fire, Trojan, Greensleeves, Hearbeat, and Pressure Sounds.

[Uli]

he he he he

[achilles]

hey thanks, Judge Vince, and I think the labels you
like suck (is that really the spirit of a "favorite" thread?)
(and what is jon, some angry badger we have to tip-toe around because of his "strongly reactive proclivities?")

actually i like matador and merge too :)

JBW, you and I are sharing similiar tastes--have you heard the latest release by Low? I like it quite a lot, and another geat recent Kranky release, Out Hud's "Street Dad."

[Jon Abbey]

yes, I'm an "angry badger". either that or I usually defend myself when attacked personally for absolutely no reason, just because I stated my personal opinion on a label's output when I believed you were directly addressing me. I've attempted to have a back-and-forth discussion with you here, but you consistently ignore all of the calmly worded specific questions I've repeatedly asked. enjoy your Neil Hamburger records.

[achilles]

maybe Keith Rowe can paint a happy cartoon mouse for his next
erstwhile release, and then you can explain to us how it
has nothing to do with Mickey Mouse, that he didn't even have
that in mind, and that it's an original work of genius.

[Jon Abbey]

not only is that not what I said, but it's yet again totally irrelevant. it's hysterical that you blamed me for this thread getting off-track. any chance you can go back to not "engaging me any further"?

[al j]

Fat Possum

[achilles]

any chance you can keep your word and not post here
anymore?

you do the artists on your label a great disservice with your
childish behavior--publicly attacking other labels, acting so defensively and dismissively toward other kinds of music, and never missing an opportunity to alienate yourself from others who listen to and write about music.

[Jon Abbey]

Adam, every time I try to leave, I get numerous requests to come back, including from you last time around. the fact that I'm incapable of expressing my opinions on unrelated topics without people like you bringing up Erstwhile certainly makes me think maybe I shouldn't be here, though.

I do the artists on my label a great disservice, huh? that's the funniest, most ignorant thing you've said yet. any chance you have some sort of professional body of work which I can microanalyze?

Joe/Al, what's Fat Possum up to these days? their original mandate was to document the guys from Deep Blues, Junior Kimbrough, Big Jack Johnson, etc., but haven't most of them died in the interim? is their output still up to snuff?

[achilles]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey

I do the artists on my label a great disservice, huh? that's the funniest, most ignorant thing you've said yet. any chance you have some sort of professional body of work which I can microanalyze?

let me know, and I'll email you my CV, which includes the list of publications and the magazines and newspapers I occasionally write for.

And then after that explain to me why you think it's a good idea for a guy running a small label to publicly attack other small labels; and for a guy promoting a kind of music (eai) with a very small audience to attack other kinds of music that have fans that might be interested in eai; and why you think it's a good idea to attack and insult individuals who write for magazines and newspapers that cover music.

[al j]

Hey Jon,

Yeah, Fat Possum is still pumping them out in a good way. They seem to be experimenting with their catalog too (Bob Log, 20 Miles).

The artists you mentioned, Junior died several years ago and Big Jack Johnson has not recorded anything for Fat Possum that I'm aware of. Burnside is still going strong. Have you heard T-Model Ford's stuff?

another nice blues label: Fedora. Dave Riley's Whiskey, Money & Women has it all when it comes to sloppy blues.

[Jon Abbey]

all I did was state my opinion that what I'd heard of Constellation's output was too self-indulgent for my tastes. that's it. you then attacked me, so I defended myself.

the music I document's not for everyone. it's clearly not for you, as you've stated earlier in this thread and earlier on this site. my stating my opinions about unrelated topics publicly shouldn't impact people's decisions as to whether to investigate the style of music I document, but if it does, that's either my loss, their loss, or both of ours. I temper my public behavior quite a bit already. stop telling me how to run my business, and stop thinking that you speak for the bulk of other people out there, because I don't think you do.

you get so angry, defensive and insulting when people voice negative reactions to music you like. when I was in London last week, I saw a copy of Supersilent 6 in sound 323, the best record store in London, so I asked Mark Wastell, the owner and a musician with similar taste to my own, whether I needed to hear it because I'd heard good things about it. before I even finished the sentence, he said "no, definitely not". is he not entitled to his opinion either? are people only allowed to voice untempered enthusiasm for records you like? shit, one main reason I started a label was that I couldn't find enough records out there that excited me anymore, so of course I'm negative about a lot of other music out there, as are many of the people who work in this field. as in any artform, most of it's junk.

I suppose I could get into analyzing your writing, but hopefully we can end this silliness before it gets that far.

[Clay Fink]

Originally posted by Monte Smith
Document
Yazoo

Those would be my choices too Monte.

Shit!!

You got good taste my friend. This practically excuses your misguided politics. Almost.

I just bought a pile of stuff from Document - they got it to me in less than a week from Scotland. A great label. Don't be fooled by the cheesy black and white covers. Yazoo does a similarly great job, though they don't do the the comple chronological works like Document does for artists. I'll recommend the yazoo series "Thinks Ain't Like They Used To Be"; great blues, and country from the 20s and thirties.

I'd also vote for Revenant as a great reissue label.

[achilles]

jon,
you're right and everyone that disagrees with you is always wrong.
and because you're so tolerant and respectful of other people,
because your "opinions" could never be insulting because they're only "opinions,"
and because I'm the only one here you've ever alienated with
your "opinions," I suppose it is best to end this silliness here before you have to remind us all yet again of the heroic service you provide to the world of music. i can only assume you "temper your public behavior quite a bit already" as a way to preserve your teeth.

[Clay Fink]

Originally posted by Joe Christmas
Hey Jon,

Yeah, Fat Possum is still pumping them out in a good way. They seem to be experimenting with their catalog too (Bob Log, 20 Miles).

The artists you mentioned, Junior died several years ago and Big Jack Johnson has not recorded anything for Fat Possum that I'm aware of. Burnside is still going strong. Have you heard T-Model Ford's stuff?

another nice blues label: Fedora. Dave Riley's Whiskey, Money & Women has it all when it comes to sloppy blues.

Yes! Fat Possum too. I've got one T-Model Ford and it rocks. Of course, R.L. Burnside's "Ass Pocket of Whisky" is way over the the top - it's Burnside with the John Spencer Blues Explosion. My wife hates it and thinks the cover is sexist and tasteless (she's correct about that too). I also like the Hasil Adkins CD. Hasil is a one man rockabilly band, sort of. None of this id for the faint of heart.

[Jon Abbey]

"I wish you would rejoin JC, Jon. I know there were some feuds and people
(myself included) tend to let their lesser selves get loose at times, but
your intelligence is missed. Especially in baseball discusions, even though
you're a Yankee fan. You're doing a good thing with your label, have much to
be proud of, and should not feel put off by a few blow-hards."

adam hill, april 1, private e-mail

adam, do me a favor, please. before you post again here, go back and read this thread from the start. there are still some intelligent, interesting discussions that can emerge from this if you would just actually answer anything I say rather than calling me names and insulting my general way of life. was my constellation OPINION WITH TWO DISCLAIMERS ATTACHED really worth going off on me like this?

[Pete C]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey
adam hill, april 1, private e-mail


Not any more.

[Salvador Dali Lama]

subverse
fondle 'em
nonesuch
celestial
beneath the surface

[achilles]

like I already said, Jon, I take back anything nice
I ever said about you. So quote any private e-mails
you want to. Shows what you're made of.

My problem from the start is the same:

You never miss an opportunity to denigrate other people's taste
in music. It's your mission in life--somehow you think the best way to promote eai is to cop the most defensive and dismissive attitude possible, and then make obnoxious comments at every turn. Am I the first one to tell you this, Jon? Why did you run away crying the last time, "threatening" never to return?

I don't need to waste time discussing music with you because you're the guy who's always right, especially because of the work you "document" (what? do you see yourself as Alan Lomax going into the fields with a tape recorder to preserve room tones for posterity?). You're the guy who can piss people off and feel good about it because you obviously thrive on such nonsense.

But mostly, you're just an insecure, sycophantic jerk.

PS: I apologize to others on the board for letting this pissing
match go on like this. These things happen from time to time
here and I know they're not pleasant.

[Dr Dave]

"A Ass Pocket of Whiskey" is a fuckin' GREAT record!
SNAKE DRIVE, MUHFUH!

[Fred K]

Naxos

Everytime I browse through the Naxos section at a local store I always seem to come away with 3 or 4 CDs. At $6 - $8 per CD, I don't feel guilty about taking at chance on something I'm not familiar with.

[john williams]

Originally posted by achilles
JBW, you and I are sharing similiar tastes--have you heard the latest release by Low? I like it quite a lot, and another geat recent Kranky release, Out Hud's "Street Dad."

I have read some favorable reviews of the latest Low but I have to order it in from where I am.

What do you thing of Silver Mt Zion? I really like the album "Born Into trouble As The Sparks Fly Upward". Its like GYBE but more lush.

http://www.cstrecords.com/img/asmz/cst018covmed.jpg

[achilles]

Originally posted by JBW
I have read some favorable reviews of the latest Low but I have to orfer it in from where I am.

What do you thing of Silver Mt Zion? I really like the album "Born Into trouble As The Sparks Fly Upward". Its like GYBE but more lush.

http://www.cstrecords.com/img/asmz/cst018covmed.jpg

I really love the Silver Mt. Zion stuff, both of their releases. And another on the same label that you might like or already know is Hangedup--their record is called "Kicker in Tow" I believe. That's been in my cd rotation for about month.

[Tanager]

Originally posted by Fred K
Naxos

Everytime I browse through the Naxos section at a local store I always seem to come away with 3 or 4 CDs. At $6 - $8 per CD, I don't feel guilty about taking at chance on something I'm not familiar with.

Most definitely. Lots of good stuff to be had there.

[Chris Castelle]

The CD called Mule, by guitarist/vocalist Paul "Wine" Jones, on Fat Possum, was practically all I listened to for a month or so when I was in the ninth grade, right after it came out in 1995. I think Big Jack Johnson was featured as lead guitarist on a few of the tracks. Overall, Fat Possum seemed like an uneven operation--I dug R.L. Burnside but found Junior Kimbrough's music to be a bit monotonous, and Fat Possum also put out a pretty dreary date by a guy named Cedell Davis, who could barely play guitar on account of polio (he'd developed a limited bottleneck technique) and was drowned out by people like Derek Trucks and Col. Bruce Hampton. I remember reading an interview with Davis where he expressed extreme dissatisfaction with the label forcing him to record with musicians outside of his own orbit. More recently, I remember reading about Fat Possum putting out a rap/blues fusion disc; don't know what happened with that.

But Mule, baby, that's the real deal.

[Uli]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey
[B

adam hill, april 1, private e-mail

[/B]

april 1, heheheh

[Sergio Zamora]

Speaking of Blood and Fire, one of my favorite recordings of all time in the history of the Universe was reissued by them: "Heart of the Congos" by The Congos.

Jon Abbey recommended it to me.

[walto]

"one of my favorite recordings of all time in the history of the Universe"

I thought it only got as high as number 26 on your extra-terrestrial pantheon!

Which, of course, out of many billions and billions and records is pretty high. But still....

[Clay Fink]

Bear Family!!!

I've almost never been disapointed with any of their releases. I posted a review of the latest Bill Monroe box a while back. Besides the boxes, there's dozens of single and double CDs worth checking out:

All of the Stanley Brothers stuff (their Columbia and Mercury sides).
Molly O'Day and the Cumberland Mountain Folks
The Jim and Jessie release of their early bluegrass recordings.
The Roy Acuff "King of Country Music" towver.
The Davis Sisters (contains some totaly wacked Chet Atkins).
The Nashville Allstars - "After The Riot at Newport"

I also just got the Perez Prado "Voodoo Suite" CD - a total hoot.

The absolute prize jewell of American music is, of course, "Ponderosa Party Time" - the complete recordings of the cast of "Bonanza". You have not really liv3ed until you've hered Dan Blocker singing "Skip To My Lou" or Michael Landon's reading of "Careless Love". I'll take "Ringo" over a snooty "eai" recording anyday. It's even got a version of that Lorne Green hit in FRENCH, for christ sake! What are you waiting for?!

[Gary Sisco]

Erstwhile
Soul Jazz
Blood And Fire
Pressure Sounds
Matchless

[Jon Abbey]

" So quote any private e-mails you want to. Shows what you're made of."

ok, thanks. I thought maybe showing you your own words from six weeks ago would slow down your flow of bile, but they don't seem to have impacted it at all.

"You never miss an opportunity to denigrate other people's taste
in music."

again, this is just not based in reality. one great thing about this new site is that anyone reading this can click on my name now and look at the 78 posts I've made since my return a month ago. I've almost exclusively posted about sports, except Nat asked me my opinions about Freedom of the City which he played in, and I thought you were talking to me about Constellation, so I answered you with my opinion on the topic, pointing out very clearly, TWICE IN ONE SENTENCE, that that's all it was. I'm sure I've heard more Drag City and Thrill Jockey records than you have, but I didn't mention my opinions about them at all.

"Why did you run away crying the last time, "threatening" never to return?"

I don't recall any crying, I just left, planning to not return, because I didn't have the time or mental energy then, and I managed to stay away for six months. many people asked me to reconsider in that time, INCLUDING YOU. Walt Horn caught me in a weak moment, asked me if he could post my NBA predictions here, and I came back to talk hoops. anything else is a slippery slope, this place is addictive, but I've barely talked about music here in the last month despite being totally obsessed with it.

my main problem with my being a part of this site isn't these inane back-and-forths that you and a few others like to engage me in periodically, it's that most other people choose to just read them, not chime in, and then later write me privately that I was right and why did I leave?

why don't you take all of this hostile energy and start a thread about what aspects of eai you find to be self-indulgent, since I'm fairly sure that's what's at the root of your anger? that could actually be interesting, but you'll probably just keep calling me names until I leave again.

[achilles]

jon,
I'm just going to leave things where there are.
I mean what I've said about you.

as for eai, quite a few smart people who post here
really dig it, so what's the point of starting thread to denigate
that? (Eddie Prevost's comments in the recent Wire seemed to
sum up some of my own feelings. )

That you run a label that offers music to people who love it is commendable. But I have no interest in communicating with you,
as you never resist the urge to be condescending--even when "trying" to make amends--you've listened to more releases by Thrill Jockey and Drag City than me?--how do you know this?
You resisted denigrating them too?--what noble restraint.
These are more examples of your condescending tone, and the fact that you can't hear that, just shows what a tin ear you really have. That's at the root of my anger.

[Uli]

Ah, don't disappoint me, Achilles. Don't give up. Here is some ammunition for you (my emphasis):

"oh man, here we go. yes, constellation is a label set up specifically to document every random gurgle and burp by anyone who's ever shared a communal bowl with any member of godspeed you black emperor!, excuse me if I'm misplacing the exclamation point. there's absolutely no quality control, as it's a label run by a collective of musicians, and not an especially talented bunch."


As opposed to the quality control of the producers and the talkers about?


GO ACHILLES

[John B]

matador
sst
dischord
touch and go
kranky
constellation
vhf
threelobed
kill rock stars
k-tel

many of these labels have a hit or miss track record (except for k-tel) but they all have released some phenomenal music.

[achilles]

I apologize if my harsh exchange here has inspired in some
a desire to gang up on Jon. There are no doubt plenty who would
like to gang up on me, but have been kind enough not to.

So let Jon have his final shot at me, and let's see if we can get back to the purpose of the thread, which is to discuss favorite non-jazz labels.

Another good one I like is Warp, known as the cradle of IDM, if that term actually means something. Don't like it all, but there are a lot of great releases from Warp--Autechre, Squarepusher, Aphex Twin.

[Brian Olewnick]

Achilles, in fairness, Jon called a label you enjoy "pretty self-indulgent" (I've never, to the best of my knowledge, heard a Constellation recording, so have no opinion one way or another) and then you, by implication at the very least, referred to Jon and his label as self-indulgent in what I read as a fairly smirking tone. Whatever the accuracy of that last statement (I don't think it is, at all), it is a rather personal attack on him and his work and you can hardly be surprised when he responds in kind. Then, of course, things escalate.

[edit: I was writing this post before achilles made the one above]

[Uli]

Achilles, I apologize if my one member gang has brought out Brie and other friends of his to take sides.

[Vince Kargatis]

Originally posted by Clay Fink
I also just got the Perez Prado "Voodoo Suite" CD - a total hoot.

YES!!! "Voodoo Suite" (proper - not the BF cd total) is one of my very primary musical experiences, having grown up with it from toddler age. I know every note and solo in that thing. I love it to death like a family member.

[Clay Fink]

The version of "St. James Infirmary" on that CD is priceless. There's something cheesy about the whole recording but it's so unselfconsiously ernest that it is hard to resist.

[Monte Smith]

In addition to Yazoo and Document, I would like to applaud some other labels mentioned on this curious (and downright mean-spirited) jewel of a thread: SST, Dischord (go hardcore!), and DG and Naxos. I'd even say Winter & Winter: I like their packaging very much, but some of their music is so...self-indulgent.

Clay Bob: my favorite Yazoo comps are the early blues ones you mentioned and THE SECRET MUSEUM discs. All great.

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drc200/c238/c23837215l4.jpg


Favorite from Document:

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drc200/c229/c22959vn9m7.jpg

I love old, old recordings.

[Jason Bivins]

Monte, don't tell me you were a Dischord kid like me! I practically grew up at Har(DC)ore shows.

By the by, if you like old old music you should track down (if you don't already own them) Dock Boggs' "Country Blues" and the unfortunately named anthology "American Primitive," both on Revenant.

[Monte Smith]

I'll take a look for those, Jason. Oh yeah, some of my growing years were spent in the DC orbit. My favorite band was the GIs, Government Issue. Favorite record: Boycott Stabb.

I would love to get my hands on a Dischord compilation CD called The Year in Seven Inches that I had but lost. Can't find a copy anywhere.

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

[Tanager]

I also grew up in DC. I love it and miss it, even though my entire family is from down here. You guys did know Henry Rollins went to BCC, right?

My favorite local band was the Uptown Rhythm Kings. I also used to love going to Charles Carlton shows at a place on M Street whose name escapes me...probably hasn't been there for a loooong time.

I was just sending Captain Hate some songs from a Tom Principato CD as well, speaking of good local DC acts.

I have to admit, though, I wasn't a hardcore fan as a teenager, although most of my friends loved the scene.

[Jason Bivins]

Dunno Monte, but I think Dischord recently released a 20-year anniversary comp - check it out, maybe some of the tunes are on there.

You guys remember Marginal Man? Embrace? Rites of Spring? Scream?

[John B]

Originally posted by Jason Bivins


You guys remember Marginal Man? Embrace? Rites of Spring? Scream?

No, yes, yes, yes. I'm not familiar with Marginal Man. That ROS disc is phenomenal. I enjoyed the Embrace album, but always thought that Ian and the rest of the band never really meshed. It seemed too much like his lyrics added to their music, rather than songs written by a band, know what I mean?

I'm still really digging the music Fugazi is putting out.

[John B]

Originally posted by Monte Smith

I would love to get my hands on a Dischord compilation CD called The Year in Seven Inches that I had but lost. Can't find a copy anywhere.

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I have a copy of that one on vinyl. Good disc. You can buy a copy on CD direct from dischord dot com for $10.

[Monte Smith]

I remember Marginal Man. I had one of their LP records with the song "Friend" on it. I still remember the lyrics: If I say something/that you don't like/just think about it/I may be right. Wow, that is a message for this forum if ever there was one.

John B: thanks, I'll look into that. I'll also look for that compilation, Jason.

[Uli]

Originally posted by Monte Smith
I remember Marginal Man. I had one of their LP records with the song "Friend" on it. I still remember the lyrics: If I say something/that you don't like/just think about it/I may be right. Wow, that is a message for this forum if ever there was one.



Yeah right. Monte, not in a hundred liteyears!

[Monte Smith]

Originally posted by Uli
Yeah right. Monte, not in a hundred liteyears!

Once again the lyrics of hardcore fail to lead to consensus and harmony.

[Jon Abbey]

can't have a Dischord discussion without mentioning Minor Threat, so there you go. I always thought it was pretty cool when the Beastie Boys released a video of a Minor Threat cover (Screaming at the Wall?), while one of them was wearing a t-shirt of the cover of Ornette's This Is Our Music.

back to Thrill Jockey for a second: they released a disc by the Viennese trio Radian last year, Rec.Extern, that is one of my most played records in the last 6-9 months, great stuff. I'm huge fans of these guys, they'll be in my festival in Berlin next May, in quartet with John Butcher.

[shrugs]

http://www.smartgroups.com/picvault/3737530.JPG/beetninelab.JPG

http://www.smartgroups.com/picvault/3826490.JPG/sxl2261big.JPG

[john williams]

Nice LP labels Shrugs

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0000042HV.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[BFrank]

Kings of Surf

[Salvador Dali Lama]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey
can't have a Dischord discussion without mentioning Minor Threat, so there you go. I always thought it was pretty cool when the Beastie Boys released a video of a Minor Threat cover (Screaming at the Wall?), while one of them was wearing a t-shirt of the cover of Ornette's This Is Our Music.

back to Thrill Jockey for a second: they released a disc by the Viennese trio Radian last year, Rec.Extern, that is one of my most played records in the last 6-9 months, great stuff. I'm huge fans of these guys, they'll be in my festival in Berlin next May, in quartet with John Butcher.

I played a session a few months ago that started with coltrane's ascencion and ended with minor threat by minor threat.

you know whats wrong with the world today?

too much fugazi, not enough minor threat.

[Vince Kargatis]

Originally posted by Jon Abbey
[Radian]'ll be in my festival in Berlin next May, in quartet with John Butcher.

Huh, cool. Afaik, Radian's records aren't improvised - I don't know about their shows. What will this show be? Will none improvise? Butcher only? All?

[Jon Abbey]

Originally posted by Vince Kargatis
Huh, cool. Afaik, Radian's records aren't improvised - I don't know about their shows. What will this show be? Will none improvise? Butcher only? All?

everything Radian does is pretty much totally composed, the drummer, Martin Brandlmayr, plays with a click-track live (he's also an amazing improviser, as evidenced by his release on Hat Art last year with the Trapist trio). the set in Berlin will probably be roughly 20 minutes Butcher solo, 20 minutes of Radian, 20 minutes of Radian/Butcher doing composed material. it's still in discussions, though, I'm hoping to get more of the quartet together, we'll see....

[Jason Bivins]

Whoa, drooling over the possibilities of quartet Radian. Seriously, big props for the record Jon mentioned. Brandlmayr is amazing indeed - can't wait for the upcoming Erst duo.

He's also really good on Hannes Loschel's "Film.Ist.Musik."

Oh, and Minor Threat? Hell yeah.

[shrugs]

Originally posted by JBW
Nice LP labels Shrugs

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0000042HV.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg



Follow the properties to the homepage. A really great guy has a nice little site of a bunch of classical covers and labels.

[BFrank]

If you like 4AD and the "Beggars" family of labels, they have just been added to the EMusic roster.

- Bauhaus
- Pixies
- Dead Can Dance
- PJ Harvey
- Love and Rockets
- Tindersticks
- The Cult
etc., etc........

[Tanager]

Holy shit...

/me makes a beeline for eMusic

[Troy D]

Originally posted by Tanager
Holy shit...

/me makes a beeline for eMusic

No kidding. I freaked out last night when I saw all that stuff added to the site. (I'm under control now, though.) :)

I'll need a much bigger hard drive soon.

[kenny weir]

The absolute prize jewell of American music is, of course, "Ponderosa Party Time" - the complete recordings of the cast of "Bonanza". You have not really liv3ed until you've hered Dan Blocker singing "Skip To My Lou" or Michael Landon's reading of "Careless Love". I'll take "Ringo" over a snooty "eai" recording anyday. It's even got a version of that Lorne Green hit in FRENCH, for christ sake! What are you waiting for?!

Yes, yes, yes - but what did you cook with the bag of Hop Sing's rice?

[HenryMc]

i dont like to label anything, music, people . I find it to be ....oh you arent talking about that kind of label!!!!!

[craigz]

http://www.charismalabel.com/mad2.jpg