Favorite of Bill Evans's "Final Recordings"

[gdogus]

To the best of my knowledge, there are three box sets currently available documenting the last three months or so of Bill Evans's career (June -September, 1980). All feature the Evans - Marc Johnson - Joe LaBarbera trio. Which do you like most, and why?

[LeMo]

Bill Stewart? You certainly mean Joe LaBarbera even if it could be funny to imagine Stewart, born in 1966, on the drum kit.
It could have been possible after all, If you think about Tony Williams or Denardo Coleman.

[gdogus]

Joe LaBarbera, of course. Just one of my increasingly-frequent mental lapses. Though you're right - I'd love to have seen a 14 year-old Stewart slapping the skins with Evans...LOL! Corrected now.

[Pete C]

Turn Out The Stars. Maybe because I heard it first, and am most familiar with it. And maybe Helen Keane's statement that the other sets shouldn't have been released because Bill was too weak and not in top form influenced the way I listened to them.

[Nate Dorward]

...eh, I'm not sure about Turn Out the Stars:

1) the piano sound is harsh & glassy

2) Evans is very hopped-up on those sessions: virtually everything becomes loud & uptempo (there's only about one or two ballads on each disc of the set), letting loose torrents of notes from the keyboard.

I have the 8-disc set too, & haven't closely plumbed it (god help us, 14 discs of late Evans is a big much even for the most devoted fan): I'd actually liked it a bit more, in many ways, & it's not nearly as death-haunted as you'd suppose given its nearness to Evans' own death. The recorded sound is more modest, which is fine by me.

I think in both cases Evans' memory would have best been served by a more selective trawl through the material.

[ndf]

The KeyStone Korner sessions would be well served by a "best of" package. These's wonderful material here, despite what Helen Keene might think. He sounds a bit rushed at times but the ensemble playing is stunning!

nDF

[Xavier]

I like Turn Out The Stars more than The Last Waltz. His playing is at times spectacular in more of a Bud Powell mode - it brings us all back to his first album and to great Green Dolphin Street recording (with Philly Joe Jones & Paul Chambers). The sound on Turn Out The Stars is clear and well recorded, although his playing certainly offers different nuances than his early Debussy influenced mode. Marc Johnson on bass is fantastic throughout - the first time I ever thought of him as being in the same league with Eddie Gomez. All in all I think this is great Bill Evans and great trio work, although the influence of bop is certainly predominant.

[clinthopson]

Every time I listen to the various versions of Nardis, I get goosebumps.

[Ron Thorne]

Originally Posted by Xavier

Marc Johnson on bass is fantastic throughout - the first time I ever thought of him as being in the same league with Eddie Gomez.

With all due respect to both bassists mentioned above (both of whom I love), why is Scott LaFaro seldom mentioned? He was the "original" trio bassist, and a young monster who left us at the age of 25!

This one's for you, Alex Fowler, wherever you are, pal.

[Pete C]

Originally Posted by Ron Thorne

With all due respect to both bassists mentioned above (both of whom I love), why is Scott LaFaro seldom mentioned?

LaFaro seldom mentioned? Are you basing that on one comment about a comparison of Johnson to his immediate predecessor? This is a thread about the final recordings. As far as I've seen, in the context of Evans' trios LaFaro is given his due credit all the time.

[Ron Thorne]

Originally Posted by Pete C

LaFaro seldom mentioned? Are you basing that on one comment about a comparison of Johnson to his immediate predecessor? This is a thread about the final recordings. As far as I've seen, in the context of Evans' trios LaFaro is given his due credit all the time.

My comment probably wasn't appropriate within the context of this particular thread, but I don't run across nearly as much praise for LaFaro as you apparently do.

[Xavier]

Originally Posted by Ron Thorne

With all due respect to both bassists mentioned above (both of whom I love), why is Scott LaFaro seldom mentioned? He was the "original" trio bassist, and a young monster who left us at the age of 25!

Ron - I said it the way I said it because frankly because I don't think Gomez or Johnson, as good as they are, can touch LaFaro's level of talent.

[Xavier]

The second "because" should have been edited out.

[Ron Thorne]

Originally Posted by Xavier

Ron - I said it the way I said it because frankly because I don't think Gomez or Johnson, as good as they are, can touch LaFaro's level of talent.

Gotcha.

And, there were intangibles with LaFaro beyond the (obvious) talent.

My favorites in order of preference in this context:

Scott LaFaro
Marc Johnson
lEddie Gomez

[Pete C]

Outside of guests like Philly Joe & DeJohnette there never was a great drummer in the trio in the Gomez or Israels years--all right, maybe Larry Bunker. The first trio and the final one were more integral as trios. Evans and Gomez as a duo were great.

[Xavier]

I think you're right but I do like Eliot Zigmund - taste and touch. Philly Joe Jones is truly spectacular on the early On Green Dolphin Street album. I've also got him on the later California Here I Come album (with Gomez) and he's not so good. Seems when Philly Joe Jones was on he was as good as almost anyone but he was inconsistent. I agree that Bunker was excellent.

[Xavier]

I was listening to the Last Waltz this morning and to Turn Out The Stars last night. One big difference is the quality of the recordings. Turn Out The Stars was a Helen Keane production, and the sound is very good. All three musicians are well recorded and each instrument is clear and distinct. The Last Waltz focuses on Evans and the bass and drums are somewhat muddy and pushed to the background. In short, The Last Waltz is not as well recorded or mixed.

[baksheesh]

Originally Posted by Nate Dorward

god help us, 14 discs of late Evans is a big much even for the most devoted fan.

Well it's actually 22 discs if you consider all three sets. Then there's the Secret Sessions (another 8discer!) which has some excellent stuff recorded over the decade from '66 - '75. I haven't seen any discussion about it here, but let me tell you - it's a bona fide, 100%, no holds barred corker! Some of the best playing I've ever heard from Evans.
Whoo smokies!

[Xavier]

How's the sound quality?

[John L]

I have a different opinion than the consensus here. I have a very strong preference for the West Coast recordings: The Last Waltz and Consecration over Turn Out the Stars. They have a much warmer feel about them, and cummunicate more emotion to me. By contrast, Turn Out the Stars, although brilliantly executed, fails to move me the same way. The tempos also seem more rushed on many of the pieces.

The Buenos Aires and Paris concerts by this trio are also fantastic.

[baksheesh]

Originally Posted by Xavier

How's the sound quality?

Somewhat variable - they're audience recordings but from very good seats. If you're a man for boots then there's no major problem, but if you're only accustomed to studio quality then I'd advise caution. However the amazing music more than makes up for it, and they're not drowned in hiss, or severely muffled or anything like that.
I haven't heard them in a while but tell you what - I'll rootle them out and have a listen, and get back to you with a report on the sound quality.

[baksheesh]

Originally Posted by John L

I have a different opinion than the consensus here. I have a very strong preference for the West Coast recordings: The Last Waltz and Consecration over Turn Out the Stars. They have a much warmer feel about them, and cummunicate more emotion to me. By contrast, Turn Out the Stars, although brilliantly executed, fails to move me the same way. The tempos also seem more rushed on many of the pieces.

The Buenos Aires and Paris concerts by this trio are also fantastic.

As far as I'm concerned it's all good! Are the others you mention label releases or boots?

[John L]

Originally Posted by baksheesh

As far as I'm concerned it's all good! Are the others you mention label releases or boots?

The Paris Concert was issued on two discs (Volumes 1 & 2) on Elektra. So they are legit. I am not sure about the Buenos Aires concert. It has come out on a few smaller labels. I doubt that they paid royalites.

[Xavier]

Originally Posted by John L

I have a different opinion than the consensus here. I have a very strong preference for the West Coast recordings: The Last Waltz and Consecration over Turn Out the Stars. They have a much warmer feel about them, and cummunicate more emotion to me. By contrast, Turn Out the Stars, although brilliantly executed, fails to move me the same way. The tempos also seem more rushed on many of the pieces.

The Buenos Aires and Paris concerts by this trio are also fantastic.

Can't say i disagree with you. Turn Out The Stars is breathtaking in how forcefully the trio plays - they're playing hard, fast and it's powerfully executed. Sort of On Green Dolphin Street revisited. I think the focus is virtuousity rather than emotion. The clear, hard recording catches this. I like it - another facet of Evans, well presented.

[Xavier]

I didn't like Turn Out the Stars at first. Quick listen and it was on the shelf for 6 months. But slowly started to listen to it again.

[clinthopson]

Sometimes, I wonder what the engineer was thinking. For example, Jack DeJohnette's drums are way too prominent on the Montreux disc.

Another thing that has always bugged me was on in the early Vanguard Riverside recordings, the audience chatter is very loud. Couldn't they have engineered that out?

Of course what is really irritating is those fucking idiots not realizing what great music they were witnessing.

[lonely-at-the-top]

I think what I have are all boots, Yellow Note Label, there is Buenos Aires '73 with Gomez/Morrell and '79 with Johnson/La Barbera of which I have Paris, Madrid, Rome, and Konstanz all of the same period (end '79)
So its a bit like Hendrix albums or Allman Bros with Duane: basically always the same tunes but with Bill you can almost "smell" the physical condition he was in on each particular day. Sound is quite ok, some have electrical disturbances when played in a "crank-up mode" but minor.

Out of the three in question: Consecration

[Xavier]

I like the Buenos Aires 1979 and the Paris Elektra discs. Haven't heard many of the others that have been discussed, other than the Stars and Waltz boxsets.