Paul Bley - Who's Your Daddy?

[Leon Harris]

When I first got intesested in Jazz (especially Jazz Piano) one of the things that I found interesting was trying to figure out which earlier musicians influenced the styles of my favorites. Generally, with enough listening, it was possible to come up with list of musicians who provided the building blocks for an artist's style.

With some artists like Paul Bley (and to a lesser degree Bill Evans) I find their styles individual (and Atomic) enough that I don't hear clear strains of other influencing artists in their work. From time to time I read that they are both Tristano acolytes, But I hear his approach as being quite different than theirs.

Any thoughts on where Bley and Evans come from?

Leon Harris

[Clay Fink]

Originally Posted by Leon Harris

Any thoughts on where Bley and Evans come from?

Bley is from Canada. Evans is from my hometown, Plainfield, New Jersey. There's an explanation of "Who's Your Daddy" at Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who%27s_your_daddy

Not to hyjack, but I wonder where Monk came from too?

[Pete C]

In Evans I hear Bud Powell at the core tempered by Hank Jones, Ahmad Jamal and the Romantic piano tradition.

I think the Tristano influence can be heard somewhat in Bley's touch in the 60s recordings.

[Felix]

Originally Posted by jazzbluescat

Not to hyjack, but I wonder where Monk came from too?

Monk comes mostly from the stride piano tradition (James P. Johnson, Fats Waller, etc.), and definitely Duke Ellington. In his early recordings (Minton's) he shows a Teddy Wilson influence. I guess Count Basie's economic style would also fit in somewhere. Plus, I think he played gospel a lot when he was a kid.

[Leon Harris]

Originally Posted by Pete C

In Evans I hear Bud Powell at the core tempered by Hank Jones, Ahmad Jamal and the Romantic piano tradition.

I think the Tristano influence can be heard somewhat in Bley's touch in the 60s recordings.

Pete, I pretty much hear the same in Evans, plus I'd throw in a little Nat Cole. But I certainly had never heard anything like his hyperenergetic early playing with George Russell. The earliest Bley record I have (Wing piano trio. ca. 1954) Bley's playing is very conventional to my ears, generic even, sounding like a somewhat less enegetic Oscar Peterson. It really makes one wonder what sort of steroids George Russell was giving Evans and Bley.

Originally Posted by Felix

Monk comes mostly from the stride piano tradition (James P. Johnson, Fats Waller, etc.), and definitely Duke Ellington. In his early recordings (Minton's) he shows a Teddy Wilson influence. I guess Count Basie's economic style would also fit in somewhere. Plus, I think he played gospel a lot when he was a kid.

Felix, I've always had problems with the provenance of the "Monk" playing on the "Up at Minton's" sides. In a short span of years Monk goes from a piano player who sounds pretty much like everyone else then, to his earliest authenticated recordings where he sounds like the Monk we know now, a very advanced, idiosyncratic player who sounds like no one else, ever.

Offhand, I can't think of another such similar evolution. (Although the stylistic devolution of John Hicks from ESP wildman to mainstream player 10 years later, comes close)


Leon Harris

[stonemonkts]

I've thought about this since the thread was started. I listen to Bley on an almost daily basis, but for the life of me, I can't 'hear' anyone in Bley's playing, per se. If anything, I hear a strong influence of late 19th c. 'classical' styles such as Debussy, but in terms of jazz, I can't pin down any one particular progenitor.

[Enforcer]

Originally Posted by Leon Harris

I've always had problems with the provenance of the "Monk" playing on the "Up at Minton's" sides. In a short span of years Monk goes from a piano player who sounds pretty much like everyone else then, to his earliest authenticated recordings where he sounds like the Monk we know now, a very advanced, idiosyncratic player who sounds like no one else, ever.

Offhand, I can't think of another such similar evolution. (Although the stylistic devolution of John Hicks from ESP wildman to mainstream player 10 years later, comes close)


Leon Harris

It's not as extreme or sudden as Monk's evolution, but the transformation of Miles Davis stands out for me. On his sides with Parker, he sounds like a poor man's Dizzy, very much in the bebop tradition and not especially distinctive. That didn't last long.