China Olympics

[Gentle Giant]

Personally, I'm glad to see all the protests. I would never advocate banning or boycotting the Olympics because I don't want to punish athletes who work incredibly hard to get to this stage, but I fucking hate the Chinese government and everything they do and stand for. They want to be the focus of attention? Good, let's shine the light on their repression of dissension throughout their nasty-ass empire.

Olympic torch relay descends into chaos
By Jerome Pugmire and Elaine Ganley, Associated Press Writers | April 7, 2008

PARIS --Security officials snuffed out the Olympic torch and carried it through Paris in the safety of a bus at least five times Monday as chaotic protests against China's human rights record turned the relay into a chaotic series of stops and starts.

Despite massive security, at least two activists got within almost an arm's length of the flame before they were grabbed by police. A protester threw water at the torch but failed to extinguish it and was taken away. Officers tackled numerous protesters and carried some away.

At the start of the relay, on the Eiffel Tower's first floor, Green Party activist Sylvain Garel lunged for the first torchbearer, former hurdler Stephane Diagana, shouting "Freedom for the Chinese!" Security officials pulled Garel back.

"It is inadmissible that the games are taking place in the world's biggest prison," Garel said later.

The procession continued but a crowd of activists waving Tibetan flags soon interrupted it by confronting the torchbearer on a road along the Seine River. The demonstrators did not appear to get within reach of the torch, but its flame was put out by security officers and put on board a bus to continue part way along the route.

Less than an hour later, the flame was being carried out of a traffic tunnel by a woman athlete in a wheelchair when the procession was halted by activists who booed and chanted "Tibet." Once again, the torch was temporarily extinguished and put on a bus.

The third time, security officials apparently interrupted the procession because they spotted demonstrators ahead. After the torch was put on a bus, protesters threw plastic bottles, cups and pieces of bread at the vehicle and at a male wheelchair-bound athlete.

The torch disappeared back inside the bus a fourth time shortly after a protester approached it with a fire extinguisher near the Louvre art museum. Police grabbed the demonstrator before he could start to spray.

The flame was whisked into a bus again outside the National Assembly, where protesters gathered. A session of parliament was interrupted and a banner on the building read: "Respect for Human Rights in China." City Hall draped its building with a banner reading, "Paris defends human rights around the world."

Other demonstrators scaled the Eiffel Tower and Notre Dame cathedral and hung banners depicting the Olympic rings as handcuffs.

About 3,000 officers were deployed on motorcycles, in jogging gear and with inline roller skates.

Police said they made at least 10 arrests but did not expect to have a full count before evening.

Pro-Tibet advocate Christophe Cunniet said he and around 20 other Tibet advocates were detained after they waved Tibetan flags, threw flyers and tried to block the route. Cunniet said police kicked him, cutting his forehead. "I'm still dazed," he said.

Mireille Ferri, a Green Party official, said she was held by police for two hours because she approached the Eiffel Tower area with a fire extinguisher.

In various locations throughout the city, activists angry about China's human rights record and crackdown on protesters in Tibetan areas carried Tibetan flags and waved signs reading "the flame of shame." Riot police squirted tear gas to break up a sit-in protest by about 300 demonstrators who blocked the torch route.

"The flame shouldn't have come to Paris," said protester Carmen de Santiago, who had "free" painted on one cheek and "Tibet" on the other.

Torchbearer Diagana said he was disappointed to see the protests, though he understood why activists were there.

"Nothing is happening as planned. It's unfortunate," he told France 2 television.

At least one athlete was supportive of demonstrators. Former Olympic champion Marie-Jose Perec told French television: "I think it is very, very good that people have mobilized like that."

Pro-Chinese activists carrying national flags held counter-demonstrations.

"The Olympic Games are about sports. It's not fair to turn them into politics," said Gao Yi, a Chinese second-year doctoral student in Paris in computer sciences.

France's former sports minister, Jean-Francois Lamour, stressed that, though the torch was put out aboard the bus, the Olympic flame itself still burned in the lantern where it is kept overnight and on airplane flights.

"The torch has been extinguished but the flame is still there," he told France Info radio.

Police had hoped to prevent the chaos that marred the relay in London a day earlier. There, police had repeatedly scuffled with activists angry about China's human rights record leading up to the Beijing Olympics Aug. 8-24. One protester tried to grab the torch; another tried to put out the flame with what appeared to be a fire extinguisher. Thirty-seven people were arrested.

In Paris, police had drawn up an elaborate plan to try to keep the torch in a safe "bubble." Torchbearers were encircled by several hundred officers. Boats patrolled the Seine River, which slices through the French capital, and a helicopter flew overhead.

About 80 athletes had been scheduled to carry the torch over the 17.4-mile route that started at the Eiffel Tower, headed down the Champs-Elysees toward City Hall, then crossed the Seine before ending at the Charlety track and field stadium.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy has left open the possibility of boycotting the Olympic opening ceremony in Beijing depending on how the situation evolves in Tibet. Foreign Minister Bernard Kouchner said Monday that was still the case.

Activists have been protesting along the torch route since the flame embarked on its 85,000-mile journey from Ancient Olympia in Greece to Beijing.

The round-the-world trip is the longest in Olympic history, and is meant to highlight China's economic and political power. Activists have seized on it as a platform for their causes, angering Beijing.

Beijing organizers criticized London's protesters, saying their actions were a "disgusting" form of sabotage by Tibetan separatists.

"The act of defiance from this small group of people is not popular," said Sun Weide, a spokesman for the Beijing Olympic organizing committee. "It will definitely be criticized by people who love peace and adore the Olympic spirit. Their attempt is doomed to failure."

The torch relay also is expected to face demonstrations in San Francisco, New Delhi and possibly elsewhere on its 21-stop, six-continent tour before arriving in mainland China May 4.

[Oger]

Olympic torch relay in Paris today,
it was a big mess !

half of the relay is cancelled

see there :
sorry (in french)

http://www.liberation.fr/actualite/sports/319790.FR.php

Jacques

[rollhead]

Jacques.... did you get tackled or do any tackling?

[Oger]

Originally Posted by rollhead

Jacques.... did you get tackled or do any tackling?

No...
I was too busy, so I couldn't protest.
I wish I could have gone to this demonstration.

But for once, I am proud to be french and parisian.

I hope people in San Francisco will be up to the situation.

Jacques

[Hudson Boy]

The Falun Gong has a major part in these protests. They are a crackpot cult that the Chinese government has outlawed.

Many problems were caused by missionaries and religion in China prior to becoming communistic. I don't agree with their methods, but they have reasons to hate religion and cults.


Here's another viewpoint regarding "His Holiness", the Dalai Lama:

The Dalai Lama: enlighten or evil?

Xinhua Shi Shan

The world has seen rapid development in the scientific civilization of mankind, but the malignant tumor of evil cults is still rampant, plunging innocent people into the depths of suffering. Evil cults such as the Solar Temple Cult of the United States, the Falun Gong of China and the Movement of the Restoration of God's Ten Commandments of Uganda wantonly preach the fallacy of "the End of the World", destroy social stability and jeopardize the lives and property of the public. Such perverse acts have aroused strong indignation of the people and governments of various countries. Many countries have staged a fight against evil cults by enacting legislation and setting up special agencies.

Buddhist doctrine advocates good deeds and extrication from the earthly weal and woe. It has also long been viewing evil cults as the "feud of Buddha" and maintaining that "Buddha and demons do not coexist with each other".

The 14th Dalai Lama, who boasts to be a "follower of Buddhism" and "human rights fighter", however not only has no hatred toward evil cults but instead shows a great deal of compassion for them. Isn't it worth pondering the reasons behind this?

Let's first start with the Aum Shinrikyo cult of Japan. The cult leader Shoko Asahara claimed that it was "the 14th Dalai Lama who personally led him into the Mahayana tradition of Buddhism" and that he could shorten the time needed for one to become a Buddha from 2,000-3,000 years to just 10 years, urging people to ditch the ascetic practices advocated by Buddhism and follow his sect tenets to merrily achieve longevity and even to become a Buddha.

The 14th Dalai Lama kept writing certificates or letters of recommendation for Shoko Asahara to the authorities of Tokyo, hailing Shoko Asahara as "a very capable religious teacher" and hoping the authorities would "allow the Aum Shinrikyo Sect to be exempted from tax payments and propagandize its credo. The German weekly Focus reported that without the support of the 14th Dalai Lama, it would have been absolutely impossible for Shoko Asahara to build up his sect empire and, within a short period of very few years, gain status as a cult leader in Japan. In other words, it is the 14th Dalai Lama's all-out "support" that turned Shoko Asahara, a swindler and a mountebank, into "a religious teacher".

It was because of the 14th Dalai Lama who persistently supported and trumpeted Shoko Asahara that the Aum Shinrikyo cult could acquire the privilege of "tax exemption" and accumulated funds to bankroll his cruel evil doing against the Japanese people. In the Spring of 1995, Shoko Asahara organized a terrorist attack by discharging poisonous gas in Tokyo's subway, killing 12 people and injuring 5,000 others. The event sparked indignation from the Japanese people. In October of the same year, Shoko Asahara and his die-hard followers stood public trial in a local court of Tokyo and were punished in line with laws.

Even at this moment, the 14th Dalai Lama who claimed to be a "human rights fighter" still spoke plausibly to the Kyodo News Service that Shoko Asahara remained his friend and that he still thought what the Aum Shinrikyo cult preached was in accordance with Buddhist doctrines. It was the support and connivance of the 14th Dalai Lama who took the foe for his friend that made Asahara feel secure in the knowledge that he had strong backing. The evil cult continued to do evils under the guise of constantly-changed names and leaders. Eventually in 1999, the Japanese Senate completed the legislative procedures against evil cults including the Aum Shinrikyo. The Tokyo authorities also took a number of measures to crack down on the leaders of the evil cult.

Why would the 14th Dalai Lama openly violate the teachings of Sakyamuni that urge his followers to get rid of demons and uphold truth and laws to favor Aum Shinrikyo? Why would he flout the tenets of Buddhism urging the masses not to do evils but to do good deeds? The 14th Dalai Lama had confessed in a letter to the cult, appreciating the Aum Shinrikyo Sect for its "generous donation to our Buddhist collective in exile". Aha, it turned out to be that the "leader" even bartered away the sacred tenet of Buddhism as a cheap bargaining chip in money deals.

It is the 14th Dalai Lama's own deeds that have step by step betrayed his real intentions and political ambitions put under the guise of Buddhism and peace. A weekly newspaper in Manila commented it was a pity that the 14th Dalai Lama wore the cassock of a Lama but played political tricks, spoke of the pursuit of freedom through peaceful means but harbored in mind the vain attempt of restoring the past feudal rule of Lamaism. Even catholic senator P. Santorum of the United States couldn't help exclaiming that such conduct reflected a subdued religious sentiment. He held that to establish a society respecting life, cracking down upon crimes and promoting dignity of mankind, efforts must be made to prevent religion from being individualized. It appears that many people of insight across the world have recognized the tricks of the 14th Dalai Lama in using Tibetan Buddhism to engage in political activities and have stayed on high alert to and repulsed the deed of the Dalai Lama.

Let's now have a look at the 14th Dalai Lama's attitude toward China's evil cult Falun Gong. Cult leader Li Hongzhi of Falun Gong took religion as pretence, trampled upon religious doctrines and thus invited indignation, reprimands and stern objections from the religious circles. They said that Li Hongzhi had blasphemed Buddhism by fabricating his birthday from July 1952 to May 13, 1951, the date on which Sakyamuni was believed to be born. His attempt to pass himself as the reincarnation of Sakyamuni and his bragging about getting true knowledge from Sakyamuni and thus being more powerful than Sakyamuni was "an extreme blasphemy to Buddhism", they said. However, even such an evil cult leader who is denounced by many people and had to flee abroad to escape the punishment of laws secured compassion and admiration from the 14th Dalai Lama. The latter first dispatched his representative to comfort Li Hongzhi and then sent over his representatives to conspire with Li and staged various farces at the time when the 56th World Human Rights Conference was held in Geneva, stopping at nothing to spread lies and rumors and to trumpet anti-China bills.

As one Chinese saying goes: Birds of a feather flock together. The real reasons for the collusion of the 14th Dalai Lama and Li Hongzhi are their shared situation. They are both in exile after their illegal acts to subvert the Chinese government and the Chinese people ended in constant failures under the august Chinese Constitution and laws; Shared nature --They are both not resigned to failures and attempt to hoodwink and manipulate their few domestic followers to carry on making turbulence and to hold back the rejuvenation of the Chinese nation; Shared intention--They are both hostile to their motherland and regard the 1.3 billion Chinese as enemies, dreaming a pipe dream of returning to China, with the support of their masters, to materialize their evil objective of splitting China.

Imagine the 14th Dalai Lama, the self-proclaimed "religious leader", even condescended to associate with Li Hongzhi who has been labeled by the United International World Buddhism Association Headquarters as a preacher of evil cult and a swindler! This obviously reflects that the 14th Dalai Lama has cornered himself into a dead end!
(Xinhua, October 9, 2007)
Truth on Falun Gong | The Dalai Lama: enlighten or evil?

[Jesse]

They will, Jacques. S.F. has been a locus of Tibetan activism for many years.

[Gentle Giant]

Originally Posted by Hudson Boy

The Falun Gong has a major part in these protests. They are a crackpot cult that the Chinese government has outlawed.

Many problems were caused by missionaries and religion in China prior to becoming communistic. I don't agree with their methods, but they have reasons to hate religion and cults.

I respect your opinion. I also think you're an asshole for holding it.

[tippy]

I am mentioning this respectfully, but have you guys not noticed that most of what we buy already is made in China? It is hard to find goods that are NOT made in China in the U.S. Instead of asking people from afar to boycott China over the Olympics - shouldn't we be doing something too?

[Jon Abbey]

Originally Posted by Jesse

They will, Jacques. S.F. has been a locus of Tibetan activism for many years.

they've already started:

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/news/story?id=3334213

[Enforcer]

We can trade with China, but I can't buy a Cuban cigar?

[rollhead]

Originally Posted by Enforcer

We can trade with China, but I can't buy a Cuban cigar?

Well, there are dirty pinkos.... and then there are DIRTY, cigar smoking pinkos.

Originally Posted by tippy

I am mentioning this respectfully, but have you guys not noticed that most of what we buy already is made in China? It is hard to find goods that are NOT made in China in the U.S. Instead of asking people from afar to boycott China over the Olympics - shouldn't we be doing something too?

This is for all you dirty made-in-China Nike wearers:

[tippy]

Originally Posted by Enforcer

We can trade with China, but I can't buy a Cuban cigar?

You can buy Cuban cigars MADE IN CHINA.

[Enforcer]

Originally Posted by tippy

You can buy Cuban cigars MADE IN CHINA.

tippy, I can imagine us smoking cigars together, telling dirty jokes, laughing obnoxiously loud.

[Gary Sisco]

There you go. Tippy's just solved a half-century's dilemma for us! :-)

[tippy]

I've smoked a cigar before. I'm good at smoking.

[Hudson Boy]

Originally Posted by tippy

I am mentioning this respectfully, but have you guys not noticed that most of what we buy already is made in China? It is hard to find goods that are NOT made in China in the U.S. Instead of asking people from afar to boycott China over the Olympics - shouldn't we be doing something too?

Originally Posted by rollhead

(Referring to picure of New Balance running shoes)This is for all you dirty made-in-China Nike wearers:

I'm a long-time New Balance running-shoes wearer, but recently switched from NB, which are made in America, to Chinese-made ASICS. I tried on a bunch of brands, and the ASICS felt the best. When paying for them, I was surprised to find that they cost less than my previous NB shoes, as well. If the Falooney supporters don't like that, they'll have to catch me first.

[Darryl G. Thomas]

To be honest I wouldn't mind a massive boycott of the Olympics. In the big scheme of things, how important is the event anyway? Does it advance anything other financial gain for the networks and the IOC? Who does it unite? How does it help with international relations? It can't even pretend to be an event for amateur athletes anymore.

It's not Jesse Owens giving the finger to Hitler anymore. It's about selling beer and Nikes.

[groover]

Asics were my favorite sneakers many moons ago, when they were made by Onitsuka, a Japanese company. Now I prefer New Balance.

[Jon Abbey]

Originally Posted by Darryl G. Thomas

To be honest I wouldn't mind a massive boycott of the Olympics. In the big scheme of things, how important is the event anyway? Does it advance anything other financial gain for the networks and the IOC? Who does it unite? How does it help with international relations? It can't even pretend to be an event for amateur athletes anymore.

It's not Jesse Owens giving the finger to Hitler anymore. It's about selling beer and Nikes.

yep, I've been personally boycotting for at least one Olympiad now, and that comes from someone who's a massive sports fan, and who covered 3-4 straight Games for Time.

[Monte Smith]

Originally Posted by Jon Abbey

yep, I've been personally boycotting for at least one Olympiad now, and that comes from someone who's a massive sports fan, and who covered 3-4 straight Games for Time.

I used to boycott it every four years. Now I have to boycott it every two.

[Captain Hate]

I think the last olympic games that I watched any part of was in 1996 and that was only because we had some visitors from France (who were amused by the USA-centric coverage by NBC, home of the XFL). Although I"m against a boycott per se in that quite a few athletes have worked hard to accomplish something in this vile spectacle conducted in a toxic setting of the corrupt IOC's choosing, I hope no tax money is used to finance sending a team there. I'd look up the particulars of this but that would betray more interest than I have in it.

[Scott Dolan]

Hey, wait jut a minute.

There was no XFL in 1996.

Cappz trying to pull a fast one on ole Mo.

[jesus marion joseph]

Originally Posted by rollhead

This is for all you dirty made-in-China Nike wearers:

What's with the French? I thought Spanish was the up and coming language in the US of A?

[Gordon B]

I didn't realize until a minute ago that Ravens' db Corey Ivy is the all-time XFL interception leader (5).

[Scott Dolan]

Tickets came in today, Gordo. We's golden!

I hope Cain pitches that night.

[Al in NYC]

Originally Posted by Hudson Boy

Here's another viewpoint regarding "His Holiness", the Dalai Lama

I'm not particularly a friend of the Dalai Lama, but I sure wouldn't use Xinhua news service, the official mouthpiece of the Communist Party, as a source of facts about him. It also doesn't mean that I support the Chinese government's brutal repression or am against Tibetan self-determination.

[Scott Dolan]

Xinhua can be a decent source for some foreign reporting, but certainly nothing to do with the DL or Tibet.

That is like relying on the fox to give you a no bullshit assessment of the chickens.

[Hudson Boy]

Maybe these pictures are doctored, or don't mean anything.

Fourteenth Dalai Lama together with the Japanese doomsday guru, Shoko Asahara:


Dalai Lama:


More about the Dalai Lama/Doomsday Guru Shoko Asahara connection:
http://www.iivs.de/~iivs01311/SDLE/Part-2-13.htm

[Al in NYC]

OK, and I have a picture of Donald Rumsfeld shaking Saddam Hussein's hand to show you too. But I still don't know what either one has to do with China's ongoing occupation of Tibet and mass killing of Tibetans.

[Hudson Boy]

Originally Posted by Al in NYC

OK, and I have a picture of Donald Rumsfeld shaking Saddam Hussein's hand to show you too. But I still don't know what either one has to do with China's ongoing occupation of Tibet and mass killing of Tibetans.

I believe that Tibet was worse off under their old system, and to turn back the clock may be disastrous. The cult groups that are demonstrating against the Olympics are not the ones that deserve support. If it were up to the priest caste, Tibet would go back to living in a feudal system - which is what was still in place throughout the first half of the 20th century. I'm no communist by a long shot, but the lesser of two evils seems to be the secular one. Here's another official explanation from China.

Chinese ethnologist: Tibet's development allows no misinterpretation BEIJING, March 29 (Xinhua) -- The improvement of cultural and educational undertakings and health services in Tibet in the past 50 years is an undeniable fact and allows no misinterpretation, Saturday's Economic Daily quoted a senior Chinese ethnologist as saying. "It is groundless and untruthful for some Western media to put the blame on China, by saying that a huge amount of investment has gone to infrastructure construction instead of local education and cultural services, leading to the recent Lhasa riot," said Chuai Zhenyu, deputy director of Institute of Ethnology and Anthropology under the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences (CASS). "Before the peaceful liberation of Tibet, except monks and aristocrats, very few people were entitled to learning how to read and write, and 95 percent of Tibetans were illiterate," he said. "The past 50 years has witnessed rapid development of education in the area and now the illiteracy rate has dropped to 4.8 percent among young and middle-aged adults," the scholar said. "China has allocated a huge amount of money into the education sector in Tibet since 1978, when the reform and opening-up policy was adopted," he said. About 98.2 percent school-age children now have access to primary education, up 22.2 percentage points over 1981. And for middle school students, the figure has soared from 29.6 percent to90.7 percent, the expert said. The government allocates 720 million yuan (about 101 million U.S. dollars) annually to subsidize boarding schools in the region's rural and pastoral areas, where the Tibetan students are exempted from education, boarding and living expenses for the nine-year compulsory education, he said. The nine-year compulsory education refers to six years in primary school and three years in junior middle school. "The current education policy in Tibet also allows the urban students to receive free nine-year compulsory education," Chuai said. "The educational undertaking in Tibet is in its best period ever." Health services have also progressed by leaps and bounds since the peaceful liberation, he noted. Almost no modern education institutions existed in the autonomous region back in the early 1950s. By 2006, 903 hospitals and 446 clinics had been set up. The country has invested more than 2 billion yuan (280 million U.S. dollars) over the past 50 years into Tibet's health sector, he said. The government has also raised the bar of health insurance for the farmers as many as seven times, the scholar said, citing that the medical subsidy for farmers has reached 100 yuan each. Some epidemics, including smallpox, cholera and scarlet fever that were rampant in the region are now under control and the death rate for pregnant women have decreased from 5 percent in 1959 to the current 0.7 percent, infant mortality rate from 43 percent to 0.57 percent. The life expectancy of Tibetans reaches 67 years, almost double the figure in the 1950s, which was 35.5 years, he said. "Some Western media recently attempted to link the Lhasa riot to some irrelevant issues to serve their ulterior motives," Chuai said.