Jazz and Politics

[Lois Gilbert]

I got some flack after sending the JazzCorner newsletter with the announcement of the Concert for America's Future (jazzforobama.org). A couple of emails saying stuff like "don't need politics mixed with jazz...", and so on.

I realized I took the risk of being partisan, but so is every jazz musicians who is performing that night or would like to perform. Unlike the recent Emmys, where tv celebs were unusually silent - isn't jazz and politics to a great extent synonomous?

Mingus
Rahsaan
Trane
Billie
Charlie Haden
Carla Bley
come to mind

social change or politics. Is there a difference? Do you think jazz musicians should be more political? What do you think does political mean for a jazz musician?

[Tom Storer]

I suspect that loyalty to political parties and candidates is all over the board among jazz musicians, just as it is among the fans (and musicians) who post here. Surely there are Republican jazz musicians who would like the music played at the fundraiser but not the politics of it. A more interesting question is whether jazz, by its history or nature, attracts musicians who favor progressive, i.e. left-leaning, politics. More so than other styles of music, for example.

One might say that jazz's origins lie largely among the victims of racist oppression; or that jazz is based on improvisation and self-expression. Don't both of those facts hold the seeds to an opposition to authoritarian or reactionary politics? Now Democrat vs. Republican is quite a narrower opposition than extreme left vs. extreme right, but whereas I could easily imagine an anarchist being a jazz musician, or a libertarian, I have trouble thinking there would be many jazz fans, let alone musicians, with strongly held fascist convictions.

[VIBEr]

I think jazz musicians can be political as opposed to should be political (although I understand that's not what you meant by "should"). The listener can choose not to listen to it if that is their preference.

[Paul B]

Musicians will sometimes make political statements with their work, though I don't think jazz is inherently an anti-authoritarian quest, as Tom posits. The best of these statements—some of the work of Mingus, Trane, etc.—always rise above the political issue at play. So Coltrane's "Alabama" can be deeply felt without any information about its background.

[Tom Storer]

I didn't mean to say jazz was an anti-authoritarian quest. I meant that being attracted to jazz might well indicate a personality not well disposed to authoritarian politics.

[hornplayer]

If there are a good number of Jazz musicians for McCain, then why don't they organize a concert to benefit his campaign?

I thoroughly enjoy the emails sent out by you, Lois, on behalf of Jazz Corner and the musicians who "live" here. There are an awful lot of "sour grapesers" out there these days.

[Lois Gilbert]

thanks hornplayer

I think Jazz and politics are interwoven. History has shown us that. What is bugging me now is how many jazz musicians I've spoken to in the last few weeks who are reluctant to speak up for Obama, even though they're voting for him. I think right now it's crucial for those in the public eye and ear -- speak up and out for their candidates.

Other genres of music don't seem to be as reluctant nor do other elements of "show business"

[gonzo]

jazz and politics are inseperable.

[Cem]

Jazz audiences tend to think for themselves, generally an opinionated bunch, not exactly blank slates. I can understand some musicians' reluctance to preach from the pulpit, avoiding any air of condescension or infringement on others' space, that sort of thing. That said, I do appreciate some artists standing up from time to time, if they sense apathy among listeners or if they are interested in making sure there's a community vibe that translates into action.

[Frisco]

Originally Posted by hornplayer

If there are a good number of Jazz musicians for McCain, then why don't they organize a concert to benefit his campaign?

I would expect a Marshall Tucker Band or Lynard Skynard benefit instead.
Thanks Lois, don't be afraid to tell it. I suspect that 98% of the jazz community is with you. Jazz for McCain....ha ha.......unfortunately for John, Lionel Hampton has passed.

[Paul B]

Originally Posted by gonzo

jazz and politics are inseperable.

No, they're not inseparable, but they often go hand in hand, and some musicians—like Mingus—do choose to be outspoken politically. But that doesn't mean politics is an innate part of the music.

Most of the "politics" foisted onto jazz comes from the outside, as listeners act as armchair sociologists and impart various paradigms (i.e. anti-authoritarianism or rebellion) and political viewpoints onto the music and the musicians.

That said, I'm surprised Lois has gotten flak for the Obama concert; I assume most jazz fans lean towards the liberal side of things, and I'd think those that don't would keep their mouths shut.

[Dennis Gonzalez]

This is a deep subject, and one addressed by a similar thread a few years ago here at JC. There were people who were pissed off that jazz musicians would dare be political, especially onstage. Some people even stated with great certainty that John Coltrane, Steve Lacy, Charles Mingus, and many many others were not political at all in their musics, even though the musicians themselves spoke about how their musics addressed political issues. It'd would be interesting to go and find that thread and see how our perspectives on that have changed.

In particular, I, as a jazz musician, always point out that if you have an avatar here on JC such as Sun Ra, Coltrane, Shepp, almost any number of icons of jazz, and your politics are conservative, it seems like a howling misstep. I also always tell the story about the time I played at Tonic in New York and played my anti-Bush composition "Bush Medicine", or Stefan's composition "Elegy for a Slaughtered Democracy" way before many would admit the ills this man and his administration has wreaked on our country, and after the concert some of the listeners came up and chastised me for speaking about "our President" so terribly. In fact, I was told I should never do that again.

[Lois Gilbert]

Originally Posted by Dennis Gonzalez

This is a deep subject, and one addressed by a similar thread a few years ago here at JC. There were people who were pissed off that jazz musicians would dare be political, especially onstage. Some people even stated with great certainty that John Coltrane, Steve Lacy, Charles Mingus, and many many others were not political at all in their musics, even though the musicians themselves spoke about how their musics addressed political issues. It'd would be interesting to go and find that thread and see how our perspectives on that have changed.

In particular, I, as a jazz musician, always point out that if you have an avatar here on JC such as Sun Ra, Coltrane, Shepp, almost any number of icons of jazz, and your politics are conservative, it seems like a howling misstep. I also always tell the story about the time I played at Tonic in New York and played my anti-Bush composition "Bush Medicine", or Stefan's composition "Elegy for a Slaughtered Democracy" way before many would admit the ills this man and his administration has wreaked on our country, and after the concert some of the listeners came up and chastised me for speaking about "our President" so terribly. In fact, I was told I should never do that again.

Denniis - how did you react to those people who came up to you.

At your performances this year are speaking out?

[Valerie]

ironically, i went to the opening of the Charles Mingus Youth Arts Center today in Watts and happened to be sitting next to a guy who went to school with Obama, is still in touch with him, was with him at the DNC recently, and said that although there is no question about what an amazing guy he is, he is also a very "regular guy" and a very big jazz fan.

i know that doesn't really have much to do with the subject of this thread but thought i'd post it anyway. thanks for your indulgence!

[Mike Schwartz]

Originally Posted by Lois Gilbert

I got some flack after sending the JazzCorner newsletter with the announcement of the Concert for America's Future (jazzforobama.org). A couple of emails saying stuff like "don't need politics mixed with jazz...", and so on.

I realized I took the risk of being partisan, but so is every jazz musicians who is performing that night or would like to perform. Unlike the recent Emmys, where tv celebs were unusually silent - isn't jazz and politics to a great extent synonomous?

Mingus
Rahsaan
Trane
Billie
Charlie Haden
Carla Bley
come to mind

social change or politics. Is there a difference? Do you think jazz musicians should be more political? What do you think does political mean for a jazz musician?

This is shear Nonsense Lois, those who who would be critical of such notification.

It's JazzCorner [DUH!] and an astonishing array of the most talented musicians in the business are involved in putting on an jazz music event.

If you ran a site for the plumbers union, and they supported a candidate openly, you'd probably announce it wouldn't you?

[Lois Gilbert]

I just got another one

jazz and politics No! NO! NO! NO! Dance the Samba please.

so I wrote the guy back with simply why - curious to see his reply!

[shrugs]

We Refuse To Be Used And Abused!!

[Simon Fay]

Jazz for Obama?

That'll be Coltrane ultra-lite then, all sonorousness, vain dramatic tenor gestures, and nothing of much substance?

Archie Shepp should be on that list of jazz-politicos. I didn't know Carla Bley had any sort of record there, scuse my ignorance.

SF

[hornplayer]

Originally Posted by Simon Fay

Jazz for Obama?

That'll be Coltrane ultra-lite then, all sonorousness, vain dramatic tenor gestures, and nothing of much substance?



SF

That shows what you don't know about Obama. Sorry. Couldn't help myself.

[shrugs]

“There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation”

Herbert Spencer

[paul cohen]

Originally Posted by Frisco

I would expect a Marshall Tucker Band or Lynard Skynard benefit instead.
Thanks Lois, don't be afraid to tell it. I suspect that 98% of the jazz community is with you. Jazz for McCain....ha ha.......unfortunately for John, Lionel Hampton has passed.

Frisco-Please don't insult the memory of Lionel Hampton

[Mike Schwartz]

Originally Posted by shrugs

“There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation”

Herbert Spencer

I rely on that one all the time!

[Frisco]

Originally Posted by paul cohen

Frisco-Please don't insult the memory of Lionel Hampton

Not really meant as an insult. He's the only jazz musician that I know who was a Republican. I'm sure that there are others. BUt I always remember people being somewhat puzzled by his political affiliation.

[Gary Sisco]

Charles Gayle isn't exactly a liberal.

One thing I've learned for sure is that politics and musical tastes (or any kind of artistic tastes) don't coincide.

Music itself has no politics.