Pat Leahy calls for a truth commission.

Scott Dolan · February-9th-2009, 02:53 PM

http://www.reuters.com/article/polit...5186JZ20090209

Most important paragraph of the entire article:

"Democratic Senator Patrick Leahy, chairman of the Judiciary Committee, called for the commission as way to heal what he called sharp political divides and to prevent future abuses."

claude · February-9th-2009, 03:00 PM

Is a truth commission anything like truth serum?

jesus marion joseph · February-9th-2009, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Dolan

http://www.reuters.com/article/polit...5186JZ20090209

Most important paragraph of the entire article:

"Democratic Senator Patrick Leahy, chairman of the Judiciary Committee, called for the commission as way to heal what he called sharp political divides and to prevent future abuses."

I can only imagine the apoplexy that would emanate from behind the EIB microphone.

Gary Sisco · February-9th-2009, 04:37 PM

Well, that's nice and all but traditionally, as Leahy knows, they've been used as a way to avoid holding murderers and torturers legally accountable for their actions. For examples: South Africa, Guatemala, and El Salvador.

The truth is already known. It's been published all along in world media.

Leahy's riposte to Cheney's "go fuck yourself" has proven true, though. Leahy's response at the time was "I was already in Washington when Mr Cheney arrived and I'll still be in Washington after he's gone."

Gary Sisco · February-9th-2009, 04:37 PM

What's EIB?

jesus marion joseph · February-9th-2009, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary Sisco

What's EIB?

Quite possibly the most ironic name in broadcasting history.

Gary Sisco · February-9th-2009, 05:03 PM

I'm so glad I'm not exposed to such tripe.

Unplug the box, friends. You won't regret it.

Scott Dolan · February-9th-2009, 05:09 PM

Unplug the radio? No thanks.

jmj, I'm not sure how the Excesses In Blustery network could get much worse. Just louder. Of course, I haven't caught any of his show in a while. I did catch some Hannity last week, which was hilarious.

jesus marion joseph · February-9th-2009, 05:55 PM

Only in America.

Gary Sisco · February-9th-2009, 06:36 PM

Hell, I unplugged the radio so long ago it doesn't merit mention.

rollhead · February-9th-2009, 09:16 PM

EIB and Sarah Palin are the two best things to happen to the Republican party.

Scott Dolan · February-9th-2009, 09:24 PM

Unfortunately, I wouldn't drink to that just yet.

I think the swing voters simply swung the way they did because of the disastrous 8 years we just went through.

Let the Dems fuck things up for awhile and they may swing right back again.

ran · February-9th-2009, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Dolan

Unfortunately, I wouldn't drink to that just yet.

I think the swing voters simply swung the way they did because of the disastrous 8 years we just went through.

Let the Dems fuck things up for awhile and they may swing right back again.

Checks and balances , no ?

An all encompassing theory to let politicians off the hook to not face the consequences of their lack of knowledge on any given position. Read the polls and then vote when it should be the other way around if a true pol had any conviction other then to get reelected.

patricia · February-9th-2009, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ran

An all encompassing theory to let politicians off the hook to not face the consequences of their lack of knowledge on any given position. Read the polls and then vote when it should be the other way around if a true pol had any conviction other then to get reelected.

Indeed. I keep remembering that the Rove gang's ambition was to be in permanent campaign mode to achieve a perpetual Republican majority.
I wonder how that's working out for them and if they are still of that mind, opposing everything, just because they feel they should to please their base?

The previous administration seem pretty confident that they will not be held to account for their misdeeds. They seem to have totally brushed aside the fact that because of their actions thousands of people are dead and billions of tax dollars have been wasted, thrown away, or stolen.
Letting bygones be bygones seems extraordinally compassionate and short-sighted given the pain that so many have endured, and continue to endure.

ran · February-9th-2009, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patricia

Indeed. I keep remembering that the Rove gang's ambition was to be in permanent campaign mode to achieve a perpetual Republican majority.
I wonder how that's working out for them and if they are still of that mind, opposing everything, just because they feel they should to please their base?

The previous administration seem pretty confident that they will not be held to account for their misdeeds. They seem to have totally brushed aside the fact that because of their actions thousands of people are dead and billions of tax dollars have been wasted, thrown away, or stolen.
Letting bygones be bygones seems extraordinally compassionate and short-sighted given the pain that so many have endured, and continue to endure.

Not trying to be a smart ass about it but in this so called democracy of ours what would the punishment , other then to not get reelected ?

It's odd that not getting reelected is the only real punitive and actual damages and consequences of our elected officials. Provided that they've not been involved with anything illegal. ( I know Illegal is a big if ) To punish a congressman or senator who's been elected , especially the ones who have been reelected over and over is who's fault ?

Ultimately it is ours.

rollhead · February-10th-2009, 12:43 AM

I am not sure this is going anywhere.

There might be enough pissed off people in Vermont who will inspire Leahy to pursue this, but the people who pay the bills for most of the senators, Chuck Schumer for example, don't give a rats ass.

The hedge fund managers Schumer represent are only concerned about how they will live on only $5 million to $10 million a year if the economy goes totally into the crapper. Hell, most of the bankers and corporate types who keep the bagmen circulating through congressional offices, can't live on $500,000 a year. THAT is their big concern now.

They could give a rats ass about the shredding of the Constitution, war crimes or violations of the Geneva Convention.

Schumer is on record for saying that the voters don't care about torture. I would assume he had done some extensive polling on the topic before he made the statement.

Leahy may be an honest man, but it would shock me if he were. I suspect this is just Kabuki theater put on for the exclusive benefit of the liberlas back in Burlington.

ran · February-10th-2009, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rollhead

I am not sure this is going anywhere.

There might be enough pissed off people in Vermont who will inspire Leahy to pursue this, but the people who pay the bills for most of the senators, Chuck Schumer for example, don't give a rats ass.

The hedge fund managers Schumer represent are only concerned about how they will live on only $5 million to $10 million a year if the economy goes totally into the crapper. Hell, most of the bankers and corporate types who keep the bagmen circulating through congressional offices, can't live on $500,000 a year. THAT is their big concern now.

They could give a rats ass about the shredding of the Constitution, war crimes or violations of the Geneva Convention.

Schumer is on record for saying that the voters don't care about torture. I would assume he had done some extensive polling on the topic before he made the statement.

Leahy may be an honest man, but it would shock me if he were. I suspect this is just Kabuki theater put on for the exclusive benefit of the liberlas back in Burlington.

If this were a religious exercise it would be called confession. And the absolution provided by confession is really the same as what these guys are attempting to do.

" I feel better now that I fessed up to the bullshit I not only ignored but voted for"

" Go my son and give up a few hail mary's and say a few novinas along with the rosary, you've now been absolved , go in peace, my son"

Politicians , having thick and greasy skins will no doubt jump at the chance to gain favor this way.

Scott Dolan · February-10th-2009, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rollhead

Leahy may be an honest man, but it would shock me if he were. I suspect this is just Kabuki theater put on for the exclusive benefit of the liberlas back in Burlington.

You're right, of course.

But, it's at least nice to hear somebody at least saying the right thing.

That doesn't happen enough these days.

rollhead · February-10th-2009, 05:07 PM

(Not for Goody's eyes. This is from the Huffington Post)

During his press conference on Monday evening, President Obama pledged to look forwards rather than backwards when it came to investigating the misdeeds of the Bush administration. It was a carefully crafted answer, designed to neither anger nor encourage individuals either side of this contentious issue. For possible victims of legal and political injustice during the Bush years, however, it wasn't nearly enough.

Don Siegelman, the former Governor of Alabama arrested on trumped up bribery charges allegedly linked to Karl Rove, wrote the Huffington Post on Tuesday to offer his opinion of Obama's answer.

Today, with a new President, everything seems brighter, more vibrant. There is a sense of hope, a new optimism... we can see change for the better coming....piercing the dark, pain of the past eight years.
I appreciate the president's desire to fix the problems created by the Bush Administration saying in part: "...let's get it right moving forward."

However, if those who have abused their power are allowed to get away with it, then it is more likely to happen again. We have seen our American Democracy threatened, our constitutional rights abused and our system of Justice subverted. We know the Bush Administration led us into war under false pretenses, used illegal wiretaps and torture to get information and used the Department of Justice as a political weapon to win elections.

For the country to safely move forward we must repair the damage done to the foundations of our democracy. That starts with digging until we get the truth as Chairman John Conyers has been doing and as Senator Leahy is now proposing and holding accountable those who have abused their power.

Restoring justice and preserving our democracy requires nothing less and that would in itself be a great legacy for our new President.

Siegelman was pivoting off of a speech given on Monday by Senator Patrick Leahy, who pushed the creation of a truth and reconciliation commission to investigate the Bush years. On Monday, Obama said he had not read Leahy's proposal and, as such, couldn't render an opinion on it. His aides have said they would provide an answer to the Huffington Post when one is formulated.

The president did say that people -- presumably Bush officials included -- "should be prosecuted just like any ordinary citizen," implicitly suggesting that if illegality is proven it would be brought to court. But, he added, "Generally speaking, I'm more interested in looking forward than I am in looking backwards. I want to pull everybody together, including, by the way, the -- all the members of the intelligence community who have done things the right way and have been working hard to protect America and I think sometimes are painted with a broad brush without adequate information."

Chaz Longue · February-11th-2009, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rollhead

I am not sure this is going anywhere.

There might be enough pissed off people in Vermont who will inspire Leahy to pursue this, but the people who pay the bills for most of the senators, Chuck Schumer for example, don't give a rats ass.

The hedge fund managers Schumer represent are only concerned about how they will live on only $5 million to $10 million a year if the economy goes totally into the crapper. Hell, most of the bankers and corporate types who keep the bagmen circulating through congressional offices, can't live on $500,000 a year. THAT is their big concern now.

They could give a rats ass about the shredding of the Constitution, war crimes or violations of the Geneva Convention.

Schumer is on record for saying that the voters don't care about torture. I would assume he had done some extensive polling on the topic before he made the statement.

Leahy may be an honest man, but it would shock me if he were. I suspect this is just Kabuki theater put on for the exclusive benefit of the liberlas back in Burlington.

Burlington's liberals (that would be the Progressives, mostly - a major party here for years) presumably want criminal trials for those who have voilated the constitution and international law, not a truth commission. Leahy (a Democrat) doesn't need to curry favor with anybody. Leahy stated last night that he'd want subpoena powers and that anybody refusing testimony would be subject to prosecution.

Leahy is, btw, seldom viewed as dishonest in VT, and in Washington - even by his political foes.

but wtfdik...

Pete C · February-25th-2009, 11:49 AM

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/20...re_commission/

Scott Dolan · February-26th-2009, 11:53 AM

Nice!

patricia · February-26th-2009, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaz Longue

Leahy stated last night that he'd want subpoena powers and that anybody refusing testimony would be subject to prosecution.

...

Rachel Maddow seemed encouraged by that statement by Leahy.
Truth and reconciliation, though, with no prosecutions for criminal activity, would seem to be counterproductive.
What I find puzzling is that practices recognized, internationally, as torture were made legal by the Bush Administration with the stroke of a pen by just a lawyer being asked to write an opinion.

I can't help thinking that Dick Cheney's suggestion that Leahy "go f*^k yourself" would still be fairly fresh in Leahy's memory. Karma is a bitch.

Gary Sisco · March-5th-2009, 11:39 AM

There won't be any commission. The dems don't want one. Can't blame them, really, because they are all complicit themselves.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...d=sec-politics

Monte Smith · March-5th-2009, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary Sisco

There won't be any commission. The dems don't want one. Can't blame them, really, because they are all complicit themselves.

Nice article.

"I really do regret not being able to stay," Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wis.) remarked before departing.

Schnikey! Et tu, Russ?

Gary Sisco · March-5th-2009, 12:14 PM

Here comes the other one just like the other one.

Scummers.