Doonesbury on Kerry, ca. 1971

[Gentle Giant]

Recently unearthed on the Doonesbury website, a three-day series on Kerry with Vietnam Vets Against the War:

Doones on Kerry, 1971

[Darryl G. Thomas]

This has nothing to do with Kerry, but the cartoons reminded me of a documentary on the Weather Underground I saw on PBS last week. I was in my early teens in the early '70s but I was deep into the news and all the protests (via TV of course). And it amazed me how idealistic (naive?) young people were back then, or maybe many of us were. These guys actuallty thought they were gong to start a revolution that would radically change America.

[patricia]

Originally Posted by Darryl G. Thomas

This has nothing to do with Kerry, but the cartoons reminded me of a documentary on the Weather Underground I saw on PBS last week. I was in my early teens in the early '70s but I was deep into the news and all the protests (via TV of course). And it amazed me how idealistic (naive?) young people were back then, or maybe many of us were. These guys actuallty thought they were gong to start a revolution that would radically change America.

Yes, they did think that, didn't they?? I was part of that generation. Eventually, more and more people realized that the Vietnamese would continue to fight, right up to the last man and, having taken casualties beyond what the Americans could stomach, the Americans withdrew.
Although, from a number of casualties standpoint, at least on the American side, they are nowhere near the ones of the Vietnam war, the lies and misrepresentations that brought the war about are more and more troubling.
As for whether a small protesting group can effect change, probably not by themselves, but the mainstream has become involved in protests and that may be the difference.

[Slurpy]

Originally Posted by patricia

As for whether a small protesting group can effect change, probably not by themselves, but the mainstream has become involved in protests and that may be the difference.

"You can blow out a candle
But you can't blow out a fire,
Once the flames begin to catch
The wind will blow it higher"

Peter Gabriel - "Biko"

[Gentle Giant]

Melanie, Candles in the Rain (Lay Down)

lay down lay down, let it all down
let your white birds smile up at the
ones who stand and frown

we were so close, there was no room
we bled inside each others wounds
we all had caught the same disease
and we all sang the songs of peace

so raise the candles high cause if you
don't we could stay black against the night
oh raise them higher again and if you
do we could stay dry against the rain

we were so close there was no room
we bled inside each others wounds
we all had caught the same disease
and we all sang the songs of peace

some came to sing, some came to pray
some came to keep the dark away
so raise the candles high
cause if you don't we could stay
black against the sky
oh oh raise them higher again
and if you do we could stay dry against the rain

[bluenoter]

Darryl--

Thank you! In the DC area, the documentary is repeating at 10:00 tonight on WMPT-22.

http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/index.html

I knew Terry Robbins when he was a member of SDS, but the Weathermen didn't exist yet. (Along with Ted Gold and Diana Oughton, he was killed in a New York townhouse in March 1970 when their homemade bomb exploded. One sees Diana's name and sometimes Ted's in news accounts of the day, but rarely Terry's; that may be because his remains weren't identified for a while.) I'm always on the lookout for any photo, footage, or mention of Terry.

[Darryl G. Thomas]

They interview about 5 "survivors": Rudd, Bernadine Dohrn (?) and her husband, Jaffe, and a couple of others. To be honest, I only knew them by reputation. Guys who blew up stuff.

The bomb that went off in NYC was meant for an NCO ball on Ft. Dix. Man, I don't know about that. I joined the military in '74 at 18 so I kind of identify with GIs.

What's wild is back in those days it was hip to think you were a non-conformist. Now a days it seems everyone wants to conform. A friend of mine and I are really amazed that with all the shit that's gone down the last few weeks, GIs getting blasted in Iraq, the 9/11 hearings, the books coming out about how the decision was made to go to war, that Bush's poll numbers have gone up.

[Jazzooo]

I don't think that Bush-backers would use the word 'hip' to describe how they feel about their beliefs.

And we DID change society back then. Just not forever, and not exactly in the ways we'd imagined.

[Darryl G. Thomas]

"Hip" was a poor choice of words. Maybe middle-aged senility's setting in or maybe I'm romantizing the era, but it seems to me we had a more questioning attitude towards our government, it's actions throughout the world.

Maybe I'm living in a time-warp or something. Maybe idealism isn't as dead as I like to think.

[Jazzooo]

"Maybe idealism isn't as dead as I like to think."

No, I think it's more that the marketers for conservatism took a page from the hippies, and added a more idealistic spin to their message of staying the course.

[Darryl G. Thomas]

Doug,

I don't know man. The Great Society was supposed to wipe out poverty. Now we're talking about privatizing Social Security and are on the path of dismantling Medicare and Medicaid via tax cuts. The Civil Rights Acts were supposed to end racism and it hasn't. We're just as divided as we were then. It seems like the one thing about the '60s is that people thought big and they thought about things greater than themselves.

I don't get that feeling anymore.

[frankiepop]

there was a revolution or maybe just an evolution, it's there ...you just have to open your eyes to see it...america has dramatically changed...so hath the world....just listen to the music for starters.......

[crawjo]

Originally Posted by Darryl G. Thomas

Doug,

I don't know man. The Great Society was supposed to wipe out poverty. Now we're talking about privatizing Social Security and are on the path of dismantling Medicare and Medicaid via tax cuts. The Civil Rights Acts were supposed to end racism and it hasn't. We're just as divided as we were then. It seems like the one thing about the '60s is that people thought big and they thought about things greater than themselves.

I don't get that feeling anymore.

To be honest, I think Reagan had a lot to do with this. I think he pretty much destroyed the left in America. If you are thought of as a "liberal" in this country you've got no chance of winning a national election. If you are thought of as "conservative" you do have a chance. That's a big difference. After Reagan, the Democrats basically had to become Republican-lite to win back the presidency. They definitely moved toward the center.

I'm not sure what forces caused this to happen, or what it was about Reagan's presidency that made it happen, but that seems to be the case from my perspective. Of course, I also think there is a very real possibility that the way people are now more politically-divided than ever before, the left will make a comeback. I don't think the left is dead, actually, maybe it's just in hibernation.