Who is the greatest baseball player of all time?

[crawjo]

Just for fun. I think this list includes all the reasonable candidates for the title of greatest player of all-time, although you can check other if there is someone else you would like to include.

To avoid difficult comparisons between pitchers and hitters, I'm leaving the pitchers out.

In my view, Bonds is making a very strong case as the greatest ever at this point. He might not win the NL MVP this year, but if he doesn't it will only be because the voters are tired of voting for him every year. He's probably been deserving of MVP 9 times in his career.

[Captain Hate]

I put Ted Williams since he's the best player that I've ever seen play but it might be Bonds. It's funny, on another bbs I just named Baroid the most dominant player in sports today because he is an absolute threat to take it out every time he steps up to the plate. He is chemically enhanced, to be sure, and has the personality of a serial killer. But he is an amazing mf.

Strangely enough, the only other hitter that I can remember being so dominant was when Willie McCovey first came up. Paying attention to baseball in the late '50's in an American League location, the NL and West Coast were like foreign countries and McCovey put up amazing numbers out of the gate. Injuries probably kept him from being more dominant throughout his career but he was a no-doubt HOF'er. Hank Aaron was scary good also but he was a steadier type; I remember loving when the Milwaukee Braves beat the Yankees in the Series. Spahn & Burdette, Eddie Matthews and Hank.

[Root Doctor]

I was telling my 8 year old son just last night that Ted Williams was the greatest player in the history of the game.

[stonemonkts]

I'll never understand how any true fan of baseball could even consider Bonds as "greatest".

I don't want to argue his merits (or lack). Just my very strong opinion. I watched him play in Pittsburgh (he was horrible, and his teammates couldn't stand him).

Now he's just a gargantua on steroids, with one of the lowest HR/RBI ratios in history. A sort of freak.

I don't want to argue about him.

[moneyp]

If "true fan of baseball" means you're ignoring his actual performance in favor of aesthetic concerns... wait, but you don't want to argue about him.

In my opinion, the only two answers worth any merit are Ruth and Bonds, depending on which way you look at it. Both were so far above the eras in which they played, certainly more than any other players. I erred on the side of caution and chose Ruth. We need some distance to evaulate Bonds's career.

Maybe Oscar Charleston could have muddied the waters, but we'll never know.

[Brian Olewnick]

You vill stay here and you vill argue, Stone!!!


Ah, who the hell knows? Bonds will likely end up as, at least, one of the three best hitters of all time. He doesn't dominate his era like Ruth did, but that's probably more a function of the generally much higher caliber of play today. If you put nine Ruth's and nine Bonds' in a line-up against today's pitching, I imagine Bonds would whup him every time. otoh, that's probably a function of better training, diet (steroids, maybe), etc.

I was also tempted to go with Williams. But I clicked on Bonds.

btw, my favorite single season, all-time, is Gehrig in '27. Wonderful stat line.

[Captain Hate]

Originally Posted by Brian Olewnick

(steroids, maybe)

Have you been to your first AARP meeting yet? The guy was built like Kenny Lofton in Pittsburgh!! I think he'd flunk a test by Vince McMahon.

[stonemonkts]

Watching Barry practically hit himself in the back of head whiffing YEAR AFTER YEAR IN THE PLAYOFFS was enough for me. Ever wonder why he doesn't have a bunch of rings on his fingers? Choke artist, that's why.

I'm not going to argue. I know I am right, and anyone who favors Bonds wrong, period.

Sheesh.

I chose Mays.

If Mantle didn't fuck up his knees early on, I have no doubt he'd be at or near the top of any list. Moot point though.

Williams was probably the game's greatest hitter, but Mays excelled in every facet of the game.

[Squaredancecalling Steve]

Most exciting was Jackie Robinson. Most dominant has to go to a pitcher, because they can singlehandedly take over a game, Koufax or Gibson, maybe.

But, for everyday players, nobody has ever caused the other team to distort their game more than Bonds, and consequently nobody's stats will ever be more skewed than Bonds. Can you imagine what numbers he'd be putting up if he had one or two formidable hitters surrounding him in the batting order? As did Ruth, Gehrig and many of the others.

[stonemonkts]

Originally Posted by Squaredancecalling Steve

Can you imagine what numbers he'd be putting up if he had one or two formidable hitters surrounding him in the batting order? As did Ruth, Gehrig and many of the others.

Yeah, I can.

He'd lead the league in double plays (hit into, of course).

[stonemonkts]

It's not just because he's a huge asshole (I doubt anyone would argue in favor of his temperament).

In fact, I would choose Reggie Jackson way over Bonds. Jackson knew how to win. Anyone recall the Series where he homered...two..or was it three times in a row...all (iirc) on the first pitch!!???!!!

That cat knew how to win.

[Jon Abbey]

I don't see Derek Jeter listed.

[stonemonkts]

Ok, I was only half kidding.

I recognize Bonds' relatively sudden ability to drive the ball 400+ feet, seemingly at will...but overall he loses points in my book for being an overall drag on his other teammates' spirits and motivations.

It is not tangible but I believe it is worth more than a few dozen extra one-run blasts.

And he really did suck in his earlier years, which should count in any "all-time" list, imo.

[MRS]

Who holds the AL single season shutout record?

[stonemonkts]

Walter Johnson?

[stonemonkts]

Jack Coombs (13) in 1910 for Philadelphia (was an AL team).

List of single season shutout leaders

[stonemonkts]

Babe Ruth! (9) 1916 Boston, of course (heehee)

[Captain Hate]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

In fact, I would choose Reggie Jackson way over Bonds. Jackson knew how to win. Anyone recall the Series where he homered...two..or was it three times in a row...all (iirc) on the first pitch!!???!!!

That cat knew how to win.

Not with the Angels; Donnie Moore might be alive if he did.

[MRS]

Indeed, Stone. . .greatest baseball player of all time hands down, going away, not even close.

Kudos to crawjo for the inclusion of Stash (do you really live in the NE?) and kudos to Pan Hate for bringing up McCovey, who is like the Bernard King of baseball. Ask any black man over the age of forty who the greatest NBA player ever was. Even after McGwire the longest shots my father and I ever saw at Busch live (and I alone have attended close to a thousand games at Busch, work or leisure) were Whiten (I shit my pants--sitting at the end of the dugout) and some McCovey shot that I still can't believe

[SinginSumo]

This question always tickles me. There is only player in the history of baseball who was an ELITE pitcher before moving to be a position player who recreated offense enough to create a new game with his amazing power, average, etc. - BABE RUTH!

Subject closed.

[stonemonkts]

No argument from me on Ruth.

In the old fan's game of what if....what it Ruth had conditioned himself, even in those days, nevermind today...instead of wolfing down hot dogs between innings, smoking stogeys in the dugout, and carousing to the crack of dawn on a regular basis.

I watched McCovey and co. play many times in my youth. He was sensational.

[Uli]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

No argument from me on Ruth.

Not even an asterix*?

[Jon Abbey]

yep, Babe Ruth sure did dominate those Caucasians. sorry, everyone pre-Jackie Robinson is ineligible in my book.

[stonemonkts]

Originally Posted by Uli

Not even an asterix*?

No.

But there should be an asterix after every steroidal player's name.

[Ron Thorne]

With seemingly few exceptions, the criteria for greatest appears to be weighted toward batting. I never have been that fond of one-trick ponies, on or off the ballfield.

Of those listed on the Poll Options, I'd cast my vote for Willie Mays. He did it all ... running, fielding and hitting, with hustle, style, grace and awareness.

That neither Jackie Robinson nor Joe Dimaggio even made the list seems a bit odd to me.

[Rob Damen]

Originally Posted by Jon Abbey

yep, Babe Ruth sure did dominate those Caucasians. sorry, everyone pre-Jackie Robinson is ineligible in my book.

Ding!

Second!

Cheers,

Rob

[Mike Schwartz]

I voted Mays, and Barry Bonds says so.
Barry has got to be on any short list, and he's the first to tip his hat to his Godfather as the greatest all round player of all time.

To this day, there is no better class act in the baseball world than Willie.

[Rob Damen]

Stone,

I think your ranting about Bonds is almost complete nonsense.

Cheers,

Rob

[crawjo]

Originally Posted by Ron Thorne

With seemingly few exceptions, the criteria for greatest appears to be weighted toward batting. I never have been that fond of one-trick ponies, on or off the ballfield.

Of those listed on the Poll Options, I'd cast my vote for Willie Mays. He did it all ... running, fielding and hitting, with hustle, style, grace and awareness.

That neither Jackie Robinson nor Joe Dimaggio even made the list seems a bit odd to me.

Jackie Robinson was a great player, but no way no how should he even be considered among the nominees for greatest of all time. First of all, he played only ten seasons, 12 if you count the one year he spent in the Negro Leagues and the one year he spent in Montreal. Second, when he did play, he was very good, but was he the best in the game at the time? I don't see how the numbers support that conclusion. He was a very good fielder, a very good baserunner, but he didn't hit for enough power to be considered among the greatest of all time.

DiMaggio was one of the first cuts. Of course, I just finished writing a book about him, so I know his career pretty much game-for-game. No question he was a great center fielder, but injuries really diminished his career, in my book. He actually missed a higher percentage of games than Mantle did during his career. Also, Mantle's OBP was a lot better than DiMaggio's. Plus, Joe played against whites-only. He retired in 1951, by which time there were only a couple of blacks playing in the AL. I think I'd take Tris Speaker, who was probably every bit as great a fielder, before DiMaggio. His offensive credentials are comparable to Joe's, plus he played a lot longer.

[RBS]

I voted for Ruth. Imagine Roger Clemens pitching for five years, then becoming a batter and hitting 714 home runs!

However, I think Willie Mays is the greatest all-around player of all-time.
The man could run, hit, hit for power, throw and there's a fifth tool, but I can't remember what it is!