Dont laugh at us pooooooor Canadians

[Jazzzoline]

The Prime Minister almost called a new election for this. I wish he did.

the story here

[Richardo Caerleoni]

Jazzzoline - Not laughing. at all ...it's been a Uk /European story too.

You (Canada) buy UK junk atom submarines that the UK sells like a used car lot...good owner, rarely used, twice round the block, old ladies only , but buyer beware...they are crap..."Hey, Joey, how more of those things we got in the back lot ?"

Now people die?

If you don't sue, you should.............?
-----------------------------


Stricken sub arrives at Faslane
A Canadian submarine which was left drifting in mid-Atlantic after a fire five days ago has arrived at a Scottish naval base.
One crewman died and two were injured in the blaze on board HMCS Chicoutimi, 100 miles off Ireland, on Tuesday.
The submarine and its 54 crew were towed to Faslane, on the Clyde, by two tugs from the naval base.

Admiral Bruce MacLean of the Canadian Navy said he was "absolutely convinced" the Chicoutimi had been fit for use.


He told a news conference he believed the submarine was "in all respects ready to sail and go to sea" when it left Faslane.

'Very proud'

He said the board of inquiry would be "absolutely vital" to finding out what happened. Its investigations would begin shortly in Faslane.

The admiral rejected suggestions human error must have been the cause of the fire.

He said he was "very proud" of the submarine's crew and the "remarkable things" they had done in making it back to Faslane but was sorry for the loss of Lieutenant Chris Saunders' life.

It has emerged that a second crew member nearly died after being swept overboard as rescuers battled to attach a tow line to the submarine.

He was rescued by a Royal Navy diver.

The salvage vessel Anglian Prince began towing the sub, which was adrift 140km off the coast of Ireland, on Thursday night.

Taken on board

The Carolyn Chouest, a US support vessel, took over that task and allowed the vessel to increase its speed from three knots to eight or nine knots.

Two tugs from Faslane then took the Chicoutimi on tow as it passed Cumbrae.

A Canadian patrol frigate, HMCS St John's, is also providing logistic and moral support for the crew.


Small groups of Canadian submariners were taken on board the Royal Navy frigate HMS Montrose to allow them to shower, get hot food and to make phone calls and send e-mails home.

BBC correspondent Mark Simpson said the submarine's commanding officer had reportedly said: "I have a bunch of rock stars on board. I would sail anywhere with this bunch of guys."

Our correspondent said UK Defence Secretary Geoff Hoon appeared to be saying faults on the submarine were a Canadian rather than a British problem.

Mr Hoon is to meet his Canadian counterpart on Monday.

Seriously ill

The 21-year-old submarine, once the property of the Royal Navy, was handed over at Faslane last Saturday.

But on Tuesday, as it headed back to Nova Scotia, a fire broke out on board, seriously injuring three crewmen.

Lieutenant Saunders, a 32-year-old father-of-two, died from smoke inhalation.

One of the injured crewmen is no longer in a critical condition, although he remains seriously ill in Sligo General Hospital in the Republic of Ireland. The other man is expected to be discharged soon.



Canadian Prime Minister Paul Martin delayed a visit to Russia, France and Hungary by 48 hours in order to attend the return home of Mr Saunders' remains.

The fire on Tuesday damaged the submarine's electrical distribution system and switchboard.

HMS Montrose was first on the scene, followed by HMS Marlborough and the Royal Fleet Auxiliary's Wave Knight and Argus vessels, along with two tugs - the Anglian Prince and the Carolyn Chouest.

The fire has prompted opposition parties to accuse the Canadian government of buying "inferior submarines" on the cheap.

Up to standard

The leader of the official opposition has demanded "a full inquiry" into the affair.

All four former Royal Navy vessels are said to have had technical difficulties. HMCS Chicoutimi was decommissioned in the early 1990s. It was then refitted by Bae Systems before being re-commissioned for service in the Canadian Navy.

Mr Hoon told BBC Radio 4's World this Weekend programme that the vessels had been brought up to Royal Navy standards. [Full working Stereo]

"They had undergone rigorous trials and tests and, indeed, Canada has had the opportunity over very many years of surveying the boats and obviously has been in negotiation with the United Kingdom during that period," he said.


Story from BBC NEWS:

[patricia]

It was only a matter of time before a tragedy like this was bound to happen.

[claude]

Tack this onto the helicopter fiasco and you can see what kind of leadership we have in the military/government.

[lynn]

At least they had the forethought to opt out of Iraq. No small feat considering the pressure.

[patricia]

Originally Posted by lynn

At least they had the forethought to opt out of Iraq. No small feat considering the pressure.

Our military were, and are committed to Afghanistan and several other countries in the world, on peace-keeping missions. We have never pretended to have the military might of the U.S. No country in the world can claim they do.
Refusing to field troops, which Canada is entitled to do, just because George Bush wanted his war in Iraq has cost our country dearly. The Bush administration, petulantly, has put logs on the road with regard to trade because we refused to go to Iraq. How can he expect any help from countries he scoffed at prior to his war??
Mr Kerry is right when he says that Mr Bush has pushed away long-time allies by stating, as policy, that no country whose soldiers didn't agree to join his ill-advised war may take part in the reconstruction of the damage his "coalition of the willing" caused.
The attitude is now that the Bush Administration shook the hornet's nest, now they can deal with the aftermath.
I actually think that Mr Kerry is being much more brave than most in even running for the Presidency. Who among us would even attempt to take up the task of restoring America's place on the world stage??

[Jazzzoline]

Originally Posted by Richardo Caerleoni

Jazzzoline - Not laughing. at all ...it's been a Uk /European story too.

You (Canada) buy UK junk atom submarines that the UK sells like a used car lot...good owner, rarely used, twice round the block, old ladies only , but buyer beware...they are crap..."Hey, Joey, how more of those things we got in the back lot ?"

Now people die?

It's not the first time countries like UK (USA did that too) try to sell there crap at high price when they see opportunities. I'm reading a book about the Rwanda genocide in 1994 and the autor tells about how those countries tried to sell rusted crap from WWII.

[Jazzzoline]

Originally Posted by Jazzzoline

It's not the first time countries like UK (USA did that too) try to sell there crap at high price when they see opportunities. I'm reading a book about the Rwanda genocide in 1994 and the autor tells about how those countries tried to sell rusted crap from WWII.

Pitifull

[patricia]

Originally Posted by Jazzzoline

It's not the first time countries like UK (USA did that too) try to sell there crap at high price when they see opportunities. I'm reading a book about the Rwanda genocide in 1994 and the autor tells about how those countries tried to sell rusted crap from WWII.

Absolutely. It's not just old "war toys" either. Prescription drugs, taken off the market because of safety concerns are quite often marketed to third world countries, long after they have been banned in the U.S., Canada, Britain and Europe.
Similarly, it's always about money. When the U.S. and other countries bring in a brand new weapon or other war toy, they get rid of their old stuff, much the same way as we have a garage sale. Unfortunately, in this case and in the case of the Sea King helecopter sale, Canada was wooed into buying outdated equipment with the admirable promise of economy. This is what quite often happens.