Al Gore - MoveOn Pac speech

[BFrank]

This was an intense speech. I saw it on C-SPAN tonight. In a 90 minute presentation, he clearly laid out the argument that the Bush regime is at once corrupt, deceptive and dangerous. Pretty scary, actually.

Here's a link to the transcript. Catch it on TV if you get the chance.
Al Gore Speaks on Iraq

[Uli]

Originally Posted by BFrank

This was a pretty intense speech. I saw it on C-SPAN tonight. In a 90 minute speech, he pretty much layed out the argument that the Bush regime is corrupt, deceptive and dangerous. Pretty scary actually.

Here's a link to the transcript. Catch it on TV if you get the chance.
Al Gore Speaks on Iraq

Good Speach!


And right on the money!

[patricia]

Now that Mr Gore is free to speak his mind, does he ever!!!
And good for him. Unfortunately, the die is cast and it will take years to undo the harm that this administration has done in just four, short years. Who knew that electing a President could be so catastrophic, both to the U.S. and to it's relationships with the rest of the world??
Up until 2000, Americans lived in relative safety, compared to the rest of the world. Now it does not. The threat was always there, as evidenced by the constant violence in much of the rest of the world. Now, it's worse.
Is it the Bush Administration's fault?? For the most part, yes.

[Rob C]

I haven't seen or read this one, but his speech to Move On after Abu Ghraib was one of the best political speeches I've ever read. Gore has become something of a hero to me. I don't agree with commentators who say he's trying to set himself up for another run at the White House (or that he's crazy, the pathetic con response to his last big speech). I agree with Patricia that he is now free to say what he really thinks. Of course if he was president today that would not be the case to the extent that it is now--though we probably wouldn't be in such a mess either.

[lynn]

I would venture to say that if Al Gore was President today the would would be a totally different place. We might have had to endure 9/11 but there would never have been an Iraq.

[walto]

As I've said many times before, Al Gore would have made a great president. The choices this year make me wonder whether we'll ever have a realistic possiblity of that sort of talent on a big party ticket again.

[patricia]

Originally Posted by walto

As I've said many times before, Al Gore would have made a great president. The choices this year make me wonder whether we'll ever have a realistic possiblity of that sort of talent on a big party ticket again.

You know, I kind of hoped that Gore would want to run again, but I can see why he didn't. The Bush Machine is stressful once. Who in their right mind would want to face it twice?? America's loss, I say. Kerry IS, although Lynne Cheney disagrees, a "good man". He's not Clinton, who, if he could run again would, I think win. Kerry's not Gore either. But the one thing he has going for him is that he sure as hell isn't Bush.

[bluenoter]

Sigh. I could have attended Gore's speech, here in DC. MoveOn can obviously select by members' locations, and they did; in an e-mail, they "invited me" to attend the speech, which was free, and they were taking reservations.

[Rob C]

Originally Posted by patricia

America's loss, I say.

It may be that America lost a politician and gained a statesman.

Of course, we got Bush too, so maybe that cancels it out.

[BFrank]

Originally Posted by bluenoter

Sigh. I could have attended Gore's speech, here in DC. MoveOn can obviously select by members' locations, and they did; in an e-mail, they "invited me" to attend the speech, which was free, and they were taking reservations.

Oh, man..........what were you thinking??

[bluenoter]

Originally Posted by BFrank

Oh, man..........what were you thinking??

I was thinking that it would be mostly boring.

[RBS]

Wow. What a phenomenal speech.

[BFrank]

Originally Posted by bluenoter

I was thinking that it would be mostly boring.

Well, BN, you're in luck........you can see it in streaming video on the C-SPAN website.

[Groovehigh]

Man, we lost a great president with the illegal election of 2000.....

[stonemonkts]

Originally Posted by walto

As I've said many times before, Al Gore would have made a great president.

I have yet to read the speech, but before I do, I must say I find praise for Gore more than mildly perplexing.

Gore? I've always viewed him as the most calculating of politicians, which isn't necessarily a horrible thing, but in his case it only magnifies his wooden persona all the more. His causes are more or less my causes, so I don't object to him on that score. But as leader of America, well, all I can say is I think some people's expectations should be raised a tad.

Anyone read the recent piece on Gore in the New Yorker?

[crawjo]

I don't see any reason to believe that Gore would have been anything other than a weak president, to be honest. I also find praise for him to be bizarre. I haven't yet read or heard the speech, but great speeches do not a great president make.

[BFrank]

First of all, I don't see how a "wooden personality" translates into Presidential qualifications. I wouldn't say that Eisenhower, Nixon or Bush (the first) were exactly loaded with charm, yet they represent 18 years in office.

And second, I don't understand how Gore could possibly be any weaker than the current occupant of the White House.

[walto]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

Anyone read the recent piece on Gore in the New Yorker?

I did.

[walto]

Originally Posted by crawjo

I don't see any reason to believe that Gore would have been anything other than a weak president, to be honest. I also find praise for him to be bizarre. I haven't yet read or heard the speech, but great speeches do not a great president make.

OK, you and stone are right, he's nothing but a putz.


NOT.

Look, here, IMHO, was Gore's problem in 2000: he was saddled with a personally corrupt but politically popular president. Damned if he distanced, damned if he didn't. He went with distance and lost Ark and other southern states (including his own Tenn.). If he'd embraced Clinton, he might have lost some additional midwestern states. He's smart, decent, and has a hell of lot more integrity than anybody who ran this year (except maybe Graham).

BTW, I hope all those who said Gore should have fought back and not been such a punching bag are enjoying the constantly counterpunching "Come-back kid" John Kerry's approach of attacking constantly no matter what the issue or question before him. He's now blaming everything from flu vaccines to bad weather in Florida on Bush.

God love wooden. (Incidentally, he never said he invented the internet.)

[sonic1]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

But as leader of America, well, all I can say is I think some people's expectations should be raised a tad.

Uh, I lost track. Who are we talking about?

[groover]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

I have yet to read the speech, but before I do, I must say I find praise for Gore more than mildly perplexing.

Please read the speech!

It's a damning indictment of the Bush administration that is right on the money. America can not afford four more years of this nightmare. Given a second term, Bush and his cronies will raid Social Security for every penny we've contributed for our retirement.

[stonemonkts]

Originally Posted by BFrank

First of all, I don't see how a "wooden personality" translates into Presidential qualifications.

That was my point!

Call me old fashioned, but I need some charisma or something along the lines of a genuine personality (Teddy R? Bobby K?...you get my drift).

I voted for Gore, but thought he was a lame candidate who really blew it in 2000. This time I am indeed a "Kerry Hater for Kerry".


Walto - your post points out some of the reasons I dislike Gore. "If he had done this...if he had done that"...he should've done the honest thing and simply state his distaste for certain Clintonian traits but also embrace the ones that mattered. The equation he chose to follow left him with nothing. That election was his to lose. There should NOT have been so many states going to Bush, or ending up so close they had to re-count. I blame him as much as anyone for saddling us with Bush and friends.


I read the NYKR piece too. I found it more engaging than I would've expected.

Gore appeared hollow next to Clinton, but I guess next to Bush he is the reincarnation of Thomas Jefferson. Strange days.

[sonic1]

I think it unfair to compare Gore to Clinton. Clinton was a masterful politician, unlike any I have ever seen. He is the survivor! Still the American public loves him even after his scandal, maybe even because of it. I think if Clinton were running today he would win, by a landslide.

[stonemonkts]

I'm gonna read the speech now.

Hey by the way, what happened to your "Tough Guys are Whiners" thread?

[sonic1]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

I'm gonna read the speech now.

Hey by the way, what happened to your "Tough Guys are Whiners" thread?

Poof!

Musta been too much for someone...kinda weird. But I really don't like having my threads disappear without explaination.

[Sergio Zamora]

I'm about half-way through. Sounds like a 'Bush's Greatest Hits' so far. Which is fine, but not earthshattering. Now, I haven't been following what ole' Al's been doing or saying for the last few years, but am I wrong in saying that he pretty much stayed quiet until the shit started hitting the fan?

I guess late is better than never, but that just doesn't seem very praiseworthy to me.

[patricia]

Originally Posted by sonic1

I think it unfair to compare Gore to Clinton. Clinton was a masterful politician, unlike any I have ever seen. He is the survivor! Still the American public loves him even after his scandal, maybe even because of it. I think if Clinton were running today he would win, by a landslide.

Absolutely. Unfortunately, because you have a two-term limit for your Presidents, Clinton couldn't run for a third term, but if he had run against Bush, there would have been no contest. Hanging chads??? Wouldn't have mattered. Bush would have been standing there, worse than he was in the first debate with Kerry, with nothing at all to say.
I agree that Gore's biggest mistake when he ran against Bush was that he didn't bring Bill Clinton into his tent. He could have had no greater enhancer than that. Clinton had faults, God knows, but he still has the personality and the intelligence that he always did and people who loved him, still do, even though he is long out of office.
Gore should have ignored his advisors who seem to have told him to be middle of the road, non-confrontational, bland. With Gore, telling him to be neutral was the kiss of death. He is not usually a firebrand at the best of times, which makes his latest speech all the more amazing. Who knew??
Somebody should have brought that out of him in 2000. Oh well. Too soon old. Too late smart.
The manipulation in Florida, however, would probably still sunk him. The fix was in.
I still remember the scene in the hotel room with Bush Sr, Jeb Bush and Dubya, as the results were coming in. They were curiously unworried, even though the results seemed to point to a Gore win. I still think that they knew what was going to happen. Call me crazy, but that's how I felt and I didn't know why then.

[stonemonkts]

The speech was very direct and hard-hitting.

I especially favored the first several paragraphs which attempted to explain the underlying motivators behind right wingers.

The war-based stuff was fine but really just preaching to the choir.

For any long-lasting effects, people need to heed the first few paragraphs more than anything else. There is some good stuff in there. It spoke directly to my beliefs, at any rate.

[patricia]

Originally Posted by stonemonkts

The speech was very direct and hard-hitting.

I especially favored the first several paragraphs which attempted to explain the underlying motivators behind right wingers.

The war-based stuff was fine but really just preaching to the choir.

For any long-lasting effects, people need to heed the first few paragraphs more than anything else. There is some good stuff in there. It spoke directly to my beliefs, at any rate.

The part about the indicators of the oil reserves was on more than one Canadian television news program. It was pretty well accepted here that this war was about oil, not national security, not humanitarianism, but oil, money, power...................
If the American voters support Mr Bush in this upcoming election, despite knowing about everything Gore touches on in his speech, then I have to say that they got the leader they deserve. If they can give a President who lied to them, when he could have told the truth, smeared his opponent for telling the truth and dazzled them with his fancy footwork, they will disappoint me.
Truth, as we have all told our kids and been told ourselves by our own parents, is the ONLY thing that really matters. If you cannot believe your President, whatever other good qualities he has really don't matter. Or is truth not that important in a leader??

[Monte Smith]

In these the latter days of the Gorebot Series 2000, it's difficult to determine if the unit looks crazier than he sounds or if he sounds even crazier than he looks. With this speech at Georgetown University, I thought he sounded a lot crazier than he looked...but then I was listening to the speech on the radio. The line that almost sent my Ford Taurus into a bus shelter was Gore's saddened and agonizingly premeditated reference, in passing, to the "widespread use of torture by America's military on civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan." I mean there is overstatement and then there is pernicious calumny bordering on sedition. From a public figger, no less. From someone who thought he could be President. Shame on him.

I'm not one to foment political violence, but someone really ought to grab Al by the back of the underpants and tug.