Okay the, is THIS getting play in the US media?

[Deke]

Wear a seatbelt.

P.S. It takes about 5 hours to load. Go and make dinner...

Originally Posted by Deke

P.S. It takes about 5 hours to load. Go and make dinner...

Not the greatest sales pitch.

[Sand]

Originally Posted by Scott Dolan

Not the greatest sales pitch.

It was up right away on slow broadband.

[Sand]

Originally Posted by Sand

It was up right away on slow broadband.

But did not have time to read anything after watching the animation

[Brian Olewnick]

It was a topic of discussion here some months ago (not this particular video, but the general idea). Personally, I think it's full of holes, not the least of which is: Well, then what happend to the non-crashing flight and the people aboard? Are they being held on Gitmo or something?

[james harrigan]

For a little perspective on this nonsense, here's something from another page on the site that produced the video:

New Book!

The High Strangeness of Dimensions, Densities and the Process of Alien Abduction

With an Introduction by Theoretical Physicist Arkadiusz Jadczyk

Anyone who wants to understand the hyperdimensional reality which is the "home" of alleged aliens, should pick up Laura Knight-Jadczyk's latest book, The High Strangeness of Dimensions, Densities and the Process of Alien Abduction.

With diligent research and a relentless drive for the facts, Laura strips away the facade of alien abductions masquerading as mind control and mind control masquerading as alien abductions. She then goes on to show how the Evil Elite rulers of the planet have merged, at the highest levels, with the Overlords of the Hyperdimensional Control System that underlies the structure of our reality.

Now, after 9-11, the fusion of the two worlds is almost complete. We have little time left, and the Controllers know it, and they have made plans...…

Those who prefer the nourishment of truth over the poison of New Age myths, those who want a real peek at what is behind the Stargate Conspiracy, should get this book. Today. Read it - and weep

Actually, this little presentation is old. I remember seeing it on the Motorcycle BBS I frequent well over 6 months ago.


It's interesting.


I can certainly smell an Oliver Stone movie in the making.

[groover]

Originally Posted by Brian Olewnick

It was a topic of discussion here some months ago (not this particular video, but the general idea). Personally, I think it's full of holes, not the least of which is: Well, then what happend to the non-crashing flight and the people aboard? Are they being held on Gitmo or something?

Perhaps they were teleported into the Bermuda Triangle?

There are some intriguing unanswered questions surrounding these events, but any explanation involving aliens violates the principle of parsimony. Not impossible, but improbable.

principle of parsimony

Also called Ockham's Razor.

Principle that one should not multiply entities unnecessarily, or make further assumptions than are needed, and in general that one should pursue the simplest hypothesis.

Adoption of this principle, though seemingly obvious, leads to problems about the role of simplicity in science, especially when we are choosing between hypotheses that are not (or are not known to be) equivalent.

There are often different and clashing criteria for what is the simplest hypothesis, and it is not clear whether a simpler hypothesis is pro tanto more likely to be true; and if not, what justification other than laziness there is for adopting it.

Source:
Philosophy of Science (1961); journal containing symposium on simplicity

[Tom Storer]

At the time there was plentiful discussion of the theory that no plane crashed into the Pentagon. There was a site which I'm too lazy right now to go looking for that debunked the theory rather thoroughly.

Like Brian said, the people on that plane died. Buying the theory that the plane did not crash into the Pentagon means you also have to buy into some other explanation, not supplied, about how that plane and its passengers and crew disappeared, and who carried out such a neat abduction, and why they would want to, and how they got away with it.

Much more fun to make videos with diagrams and carefully chosen photographs and quotations with a spy-movie soundtrack.

[Gary Sisco]

Never mind controlling all of the tongues that work at the Pentagon. No one can do that. Wolfonitwitz can't even control his own.

[Gary Sisco]

Clearly, Deke doesn't understand that Americans read tabloids, too. We get the facts, baby, every week. Just like in the UK.

[Dennis Gonzalez]

Originally Posted by Tom Storer

Like Brian said, the people on that plane died.

Were the lists of the dead confirmed? Are they real names of real people? Were any of the funerals covered by the media, local or national?

[RBS]

Although it seems sort of interesting at certain points, it's all kind of weirdly vague.

[bostontricky]

I'm mildly interested as to the contents of the "captured" surveillance tapes, and why they were squirreled away so quickly.

Originally Posted by bostontricky

I'm mildly interested as to the contents of the "captured" surveillance tapes, and why they were squirreled away so quickly.

Or if they truly even exist at all.

Just because these guys say it, doesn't make it true.

[bostontricky]

Originally Posted by Scott Dolan

Just because these guys say it, doesn't make it true.

Exactly.

However, I'd suggest the same for the "official" viewpoint as well.

[james harrigan]

Originally Posted by Dennis Gonzalez

Were the lists of the dead confirmed? Are they real names of real people? Were any of the funerals covered by the media, local or national?

the answers to your questions are yes, yes, and yes.

The scariest thing about this silly story is that there was a best-selling book in France a few years ago that claimed no plane hit the Pentagon. It is one thing for some nut to put a video on a website, but when large numbers of people pay to buy a nutty bok, we have a problem. The problem in France is that so many people have so much antipathy for the US that they are willing to entertain the most loony anti-US notions.

[Douglas]

Originally Posted by james harrigan

The problem in France is that so many people have so much antipathy for the US that they are willing to entertain the most loony anti-US notions.

That may be the case (and certainly fits certain agendas to believe so), but I didn't think so, so did a quick search - Time magazine at the time it was released puts it this way

Originally Posted by those nice people at Time in 2002

French observers say the book's fascination has more to do with the sheer entertainment value of spooky, over-the-top conspiracy scenarios than it does with any blossoming of anti-American paranoia in France.

[james harrigan]

thanks for the link, Douglas, but it is hardly dispositive. I hope you are right about why people read Meyssan's book, but I kind of doubt it. My recollection is that when Le Monde editorialized against it, their premise was how shameful and embarassing it was that the French were taking this book seriously.

[Douglas]

I remember that the press generally rubbished the book in the reviews. I'll ask colleagues at work if I have some time tomorrow what they remember.

Or perhaps someone more knowledgable may pass this way with a better feel for why the book was read.

[groover]

I think the popularity of Meyssan's book has more to do with a significant portion of the French public's desire to deny and downplay the threat of militant Islam and blame America and Israel, or at least the neo-con-Jewish CIA-MOSSAD cabal that secretly runs things, for stirring up the Islamic community within and around their borders. There was a lot of sympathy for appeasement of Hitler for similar reasons in France prior to WWII, wasn't there? But I could be wrong. I haven't been attending those secret weekly meetings of the cabal regularly for a while.

Originally Posted by james

The problem in France is that so many people have so much antipathy for the US that they are willing to entertain the most loony anti-US notions.

Hey!

Just like the good folks here at JC.

[sonic1]

Oh yeah, the French are WAY off base for not digging on the US.


I don't get why yal single out the French, since the WHOLE FUCKING WORLD seems to be a little upset with the US.


Oh, I forgot. Bush said that the world was behind us. My bad. It IS just the French.

[willy]

I don't buy into this conspiracy either, but someone I work with does. He claims there is no evidence at all of a plane crashing into the Pentagon. No parts of the plane, no black box, no video of any of it was ever shown on TV. Nothing.

Does anybody remember seeing video on 9/11 of the smashed plane at the Pentagon? Pictures of it in a newspaper or in a magazine? Anything along those lines? I don't, but then again I can't remember where I live half the time...

[Tom Storer]

If I recall correctly, the plane didn't smash into the ground at a 45° angle and explode, it basically hit the ground close to the building at much closer to the horizontal, and skidded right into the building, exploding as it did so. The photos used purport to show that there was no wreckage, but most of the wreckage was inside the building. Also, they purport to show that there wasn't a big enough hole in the building to have been made by a plane, but that's a trick of perspective, coupled with a tendency to think of airliners as immensely huge compared to buildings; they're big, but the Pentagon is also very big.

One reason that ridiculous conspiracy book did so well in France was that there was massive circulation of an email complete with photos of the same kind shown on the site discussed here, and presented as a sort of whodunit, "can you answer these six questions" or something like that. The same thing went around in English, but it was translated to French and everyone was reading it, forwarding it, debating it. This was a new thing, to have a conspiracy theory so well-marketed by email. I think it was popular for the same reason Oliver Stone movies are popular--cheap thrills.

That said, it's true that it's not hard to push a conspiracy theory here in France about American plots to deceive the world. I wonder why that is?

[Gary Sisco]

Yeah. A-and the black box. Where is it? Why are they always black? How come they never get smashed up with the rest? Huh? Huh? You see?

It's a conspiracy of everyone.

[Phil_Meloy]

Originally Posted by Gary Sisco

Yeah. A-and the black box. Where is it? Why are they always black?

I think they're actually orange. I really have no idea why they call them black boxes.

[Gary Sisco]

There. You see? Lies, lies, lies. They can't even tell the truth about the color of the friggin' box. Just more proof of the conspiracy, innit?

[A. Kingstone]

If the implication is that a missile was fired at the Pentagon and not a large aircraft why would it need to be covered up?

If you're under attack you're under attack.

Perhaps this is a naive question.

[Gary Sisco]

"Naive." Yeah, right.