Men Don't Cry

[GoodSpeak]

Crawjo and Scott Dolan brought back memories of my childhood.


I was told all of my life that, "Boys/Men don't cry."

And I can't cry...even now.


When I do cry, I feel profoundly embarrassed...like there is something terribly wrong with me.

You see, when I was a kid, I was punished for crying...even beaten or ridiculed by my father or my schoolmates. I felt as if my parents wouldn't love me if I cried. I knew my father didn't.

I absolutely envy those men who can cry, freely, without shame and still be a man. I am amazed by it.



I....just cannot do it.




And I wonder if there is anyone else who feels as I do....




















I really do.

Oh my.


Time for sensitive Mo Noyz to raise his ugly but caring head.

Oy..........why do I get the feeling I'll regret this........




Brother Goodz,

It is terribly distressing to here about the things you suffered as a child. Your father was not only wrong, but he was a douchebag of the highest order, and a horrendously shitty father.

Period.

And I really don't give two shits if that offends you in any way.

Crying is quite natural. One of the most base emotional responses that humans possess. There have also been medical studies that show crying to be extremely healthy, adding years to your life. To internalize those emotions is much harder on the human body than to let them flow naturally. And no, I'm not kidding. This wasn't some liberla mens society beating drums in the wilderness, but an actual study endorsed by the AMA.

Just like internalizing anger, internalizing the emotions that make us cry can often lead to high blood pressure and other various fucknots that take years off of our lives.

I had a great childhood, even though it was cut short by the divorce of my parents. So to hear of the kind of things that you, and MANY, have suffered really fucking breaks my cold, cold heart.

But from one man to another, crying is part of this existence.

Do it, or die!!!!!!!!!!



Haha, just kidding, brother.

But like the Nike add says, just do it.

[GoodSpeak]

This is one time, Brother Dolan, I wish I had your resolve.

[Noj]

My dad cries watching Michael Landon shows.

I sometimes cry if the music hits me right.

[GoodSpeak]

Sometimes...I wish I could.

Originally Posted by GoodSpeak

This is one time, Brother Dolan, I wish I had your resolve.

I don't know that it has anything to do with resolve.

The things that are ingrained into our brains at an early age can be quite troublesome, I agree.

And even though I still love my hardcore, rightwing father to this very day, I promised myself that I would be a better man, no, a better person than him.

It's hard to cast off those things that were tought to us from an early age, but I think it's natural to want to be better than those that came before you.

I wish you the best of luck, my friend. I know I've dogged you on your mental state, but this thread has given me better insight into why you are like you are(and that's not meant to be a dig).

[GoodSpeak]

Originally Posted by Scott Dolan

I know I've dogged you on your mental state, but this thread has given me better insight into why you are like you are(and that's not meant to be a dig).

And that means more to me than you can possibly know, Scott.

[Jesse]

O.k., this isn't psychoanalysis of you, but what I've seen as an experience common to men who have tough dads & sire sons...
In the vertical relationships of father to son, you undoubtedly were liberated in the crying dept. not only by your dad's negative example, but your son's tenderizing your macho heart.
That's my story, anyway.

Originally Posted by Jesse

O.k., this isn't psychoanalysis of you, but what I've seen as an experience common to men who have tough dads & sire sons...
In the vertical relationships of father to son, you undoubtedly were liberated in the crying dept. not only by your dad's negative example, but your son's tenderizing your macho heart.
That's my story, anyway.

You talking to me, or Goodz?

[Jesse]

To you, but fathers generally who reassess the crying thing when they see the toughness code they were inculcated with broken open by parenting.
Like I said, that's my experience, matched by many dads I know.

Plus, your soft spot for Wynton is evident on these boards.
A source of strength, not weakness (Goody).

Originally Posted by Jesse

Plus, your soft spot for Wynton is evident on these boards.
A source of strength, not weakness (Goody).

Yes, but I worked past the whole crying thing well before he became part of the picture. Simply due to the fact that I HAD sworn to be better than my father.

But, you know what, thanks for noticing my weakness for my beautiful son.

[crawjo]

I've cried some during the past week. The hardest part for me has been watching Anna get stuck with needles, and not being able to comfort her or explain to her what is happening. One thing I have worried about though is not to do that in front of her, because I figure she can sense if I'm afraid or upset, and that would make her more afraid and upset.

[Steve Reynolds]

I cried when I read about david's sweet little girl

I cried in front a few people 2 weeks ago on what was a very special day for me - it was one of the best days I had and an experience that cannot be explained in it's magnitude

I was so moved by what others posted on that thread that I shared the thread with someone lese close to me to give them an idea about the wonderful people that I have gotten to know around here

and my parents are not the crying, loving kind

someone recent;y told me that I might have something inate in me - but I know it comes from something greater than I - I am grateful every day that I now have true feelings and emotions and I am not embarrased to show them - I don't know what to say, Tim - except that if you do cry, you have nothing to be ashamed of

[Gary Sisco]

That's shit about guys not crying. They do. Even the toughest of them do. What the hell, it's a basic emotional response (and not only to sadness but also many other things as well) programmed into us.

My old man was a hardcore motherfucker, too, when I was a kid, and being the oldest, I got the brunt of it. He mellowed some with each kid and had very mellowed by the time my middle age had come around. But when I was a kid and living in his house he was one hard motherfucker, no doubt. He established law and if the law was broken, you got your ass kicked enough to remember it and then some.

He's probably the reason why I decided, also while still a kid, not to ever be a father -- one of the rare oaths we make that actually are fulfilled. But, to tell the truth, if I'm to judge by those who've come up after they started locking up guys like my old man and taking their kids from them and all of that ... I'm glad he was as hard as he was, even though there was definite damage involved. Truth is, it's a hard world, and it's going to be. No one's exempt. A contradiction, I know, but I'm glad I learned certain necessary lessons as a kid and not as an adult, when it would have been much more surprising and traumatic, actually.

I was also assaulted numerous times as a teen by teachers, cops, and rednecks. Vermont wasn't exactly lalaland in the 60s, pre-hippy-cum-yuppy invasion. It had no use for the likes of me, anyway, as was made clear enough.

Still, I cry when the feeling hits me hard enough. I can choke it back til a later and more appropriate time if need be, but that to me is a matter of social grace and etiquette, more than anything else. The hardest thing I ever did, that way, was not break down when my father's best friend handed me the flag at his funeral, and we went through that whole ritual, face to face, eyes locked. I did break afterwards, when alone in the car with Bronwyn.

[steve(thelil)]

I cry when i read about you wusses crying.

[Gary Sisco]

Fuck you, you fucking saint.

[Jimmy Cantiello]

I cried when I got the bill for my kids' college tuition..............

[Gary Sisco]

I'm crying in happiness that I never got such a bill.

[Jimmy Cantiello]

Just joking, Gary. The truth is I only agreed to pay for part of their tuition. They are responsible for the rest. Having to foot some of the bill makes for better grades and teaches responsibility..........

Still an old school mofo,
Jimmy

[Gary Sisco]

True nuff. I totally agree with you about that. When I went to college on the GI Bill, the old man told me he'd pick up the tab for my books *after* I'd completed a full year without dropping out. And he did. In those days, it came to something like 125 bucks a semester or something, but it was a help for sure. The GI Bill check was enough to cover my rent and utilities. I worked for the rest.

Another good lesson I learned from him, though I never had to put it into effect. When I turned 15, he told me: "You're going to want to drive soon, so if I were you, I'd be working my ass off and saving some money, because you're not going to drive my car and I'm not going to pay for your insurance." Smart motherfucker, really. Now that I'm much older than he was at the time he said that, I can see just how smart he was.

None of that, Um, dad? I'm sorry to have to tell you this, but I'm at the cop shop and I just wrapped your car around a tree.

[Jim Dye]

The Man Who Wouldn't Cry
(Loudon Wainwright III)

There once was a man who just couldn't cry
He hadn't cried for years and for years
Napalmed babies and the movie 'Love Story'
For instance could not produce tears
As a child he had cried as all children will
Then at some point his tear ducts ran dry
He grew to be a man, the feces hit the fan
Things got bad, but he couldn't cry

His dog was run over, his wife up and left him
And after that he got sacked from his job
Lost his arm in the war, was laughed at by a whore
Ah, but sill not a sniffle or sob

His novel was refused, his movie was panned
And his big Broadway show was a flop

He got sent off to jail; you guessed it, no bail
Oh, but still not a dribble or drop

In jail he was beaten, bullied and buggered
And made to make license plates
Water and bread was all he was fed
But not once did a tear stain his face

Doctors were called in, scientists, too
Theologians were last and practically least

They all agreed sure enough; this was sure no cream puff
But in fact an insensitive beast

He was removed from jail and placed in a place
For the insensitive and the insane
He played lots of chess and made lots of friends
And he wept every time it would rain

Once it rained forty days and it rained forty nights
And he cried and he cried and he cried and he cried

On the forty-first day, he passed away
He just dehydrated and died

Well, he went up to heaven, located his dog
Not only that, but he rejoined his arm
Down below, all the critics, they took it all back
Cancer robbed the whore of her charm

His ex-wife died of stretch marks, his ex-employer went broke
The theologians were finally found out

Right down to the ground, that old jail house burned down
The earth suffered perpetual drought

[Pete C]

Goodspeak, there's nothing to feel guilty about for not crying either. We all handle strong emotions in our personal way. Tears are not necessary. We can "cry" without them. I'm not especially lachrymose.

Crying is probably a good release, but feeling guilty about not crying is as damaging to one's self as feeling guilty about crying is.

[clinthopson]

I can't remember the last time I actually cried, you know lots of tears and body racking sobs. But I do get teary eyed these days when I see my grandkids or when one of them gets sick. It's probably because I'm an old fart.

Wait, I remember the last time I cried. I got on my bicycle and landed the worng way.

[Jesse]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Pete C

I'm not especially lachrymose.

You're milk intolerant?

[Squaredancecalling Steve]

Like Clint, I can't remember the last time I sobbed and wailed, although the deaths of friends can leave me teary for days. But I cry a little almost every day. It doesn't take much -- old songs, faces of my family, beautiful writing, tv commercials...My family was into the arts, and crying was a sign of passion, not frowned upon at all.

[RBS]

Originally Posted by GoodSpeak

I absolutely envy those men who can cry, freely, without shame and still be a man. I am amazed by it.

I really do.

I feel for you GoodSpeak. I really do. It feels good to cry and those judgments that your background railed upon you are just that, judgments.

I hear a real "cry" for help. Perhaps you could talk it out with some friends. The feelings of shame and self-judgment may do more harm to you than actually crying. It's very liberating to let it go. I cried when my daughter was born and when I got married.

You are a man, whether you cry or whether you don't.

Maybe you can find a good therapist or healer to talk to? Someone who will make you feel safe enough to talk these things out with.

[steve(thelil)]

Waah waah waah waah : I Can't Cry

[Squaredancecalling Steve]

The greatest crying jag on record: Valarie, by The Starlites -- off the charts! Distant second, Clyde McPhatter with Billy Ward and The Dominoes on The Bells.

[Pete C]

Goodspeak, don't listen to these crybabies. You don't HAVE to cry. It's not a problem unless you make it one.

[Pete C]

[QUOTE=Jesse]

You're milk intolerant?

Yes, I'm incapable of crying over spilled milk.